Meetings

[sna103079]

Does it mean that someone is heading for re-lapse if they refuse to go to meetings?

He says "I don't relate to them", "All they talk about is how bad their life is", "I can do this by myself", "I stopped taking drugs because I want to, I don't need to talk about it"

If anyone has read my posts before, you know my husband is an addict and has been clean from his DOC for 18 days and 8 days off suboxone.

Are meeting just not for every addict or am I just getting a bunch of **** from him?

Sorry if I'm being a pest, but none of my friends relate to what I'm going through and I don't think I would have made it this far if it wasn't for this site and your responses........

[Fergman]

It has got to be difficult for you.  You say he has been sober for 18 days now?  Did you ever have that one time and one time only discussion about his addiction?  Just a thought I want to share - you "may" want to insist on his taking a drug test if you are  reasonably suspicious.  If he fails, he agrees to go to rehab.  I think a stance like that is like drawing a line in the sand.  It's concrete and understandable, but you can only play this card so often. It's not meant to be an ultimatum, but it certainly is a bull**** detector. Just a suggestion.  By the way, you have two lovely children!

[bigmikesalive]

You made my day !!

You are a amazingly tough person who is on the right path. It takes someone who really wants to know if they are doing something right or wrong, to put your information out there and to listen to all the great post from everyone today, and walk away thinking hard about your future without prejudice.

I don't like to judge cause God knows I,, we, here have made so many mistakes but something in my heart doesnt want you to make the same ones, and with your response makes me truley feel that you are chosing to make the right ones ( choices )

Remember whatever you ultimatey chose to do, deep down in your heart it has to be the last resort, with you opening up tp us here makes us know that you are going to fight hard for your husband and familty, which is something many of us commend you for. I know I do.

I hope your husband when he gets the help he needs will cherish for all time the fight that you are deep into at this time.

Now l will go back to lurker land, hahaha I feel like Gollum,

Rock on ! Big Mike

[owhatamistake]

Personally, I don't like meetings so much...over the past 20 years I've gone to my fair share...I do much better with one on one therapy.  Maybe you could see if he would go to a therapist/counselor.  If that's not a possibility, he needs to find a/the meetings that are for him.  Meetings are sort of like shoes...you have to find the ones that fit.  Aftercare is so, so important.  The physical pales in comparison to the mental...IMHO.  Good luck!

[sna103079]

Thanks again everyone! I appreciate all of you! I think in a way this forum is the start to my therapy...

Big Mike, thanks for coming out of lurker land! You will definitely not get any heat from me. I take all advise and translate them all to what is relevant and what may help. And I thank you from the bottom of my heart for posting.

My biggest challenge has been to educate myself. I have always been very stubborn when it comes to his addiction because I did not want to know. I have always prided myself on the fact that through my 29 years (turned 29 today!) I have never done any drugs, never once... and it has been offered a lot. I just always looked at it as this is something I can always be proud to tell my children.

Yesterday was most certainly a very tough day for me. I did go home with the wrong attitude and it didn't work out well for myself or my husband. I think that I am so worried that I will continue to enable him as I always have in the past that I am being extra careful to find that fine line of enabling and supporting and not cross it. I did explain to him that some of his actions in the last two days have crossed my line of what I will tolerate (calling old friend, etc.). I explained that I am very proud of him but just because he has quit does not mean that the war has been won.

My mind scatters all over the place most of the time so sorry if some of my posts are confusing. You guys are really all I have right now......

[avisg]

Mike that was a great post ,,,Help for both of them is very important ... It has become a problem for the two of them .enabling is such an easy thing to do  I think many do it without even realizing it and very hard to stop . Nobody wants to see there partner suffer and as addicts we are great manipulators.We tend to play on our families emotions and convice the to enable our use ....

[bigmikesalive]

Hey I've read many of your posts and I know I'm going to get some heat on this but, here it goes.

There is some absoulty great info on how you should proceed from many good people who for once didn't say anything about their problems but directly addressed yours, good job everyone. I'm not being judemental I really am glad to see your posts, I'm not trying to be above anyone and please if I'm wording this incorrectly I appologize, there are so many good people on this site.

Now for the heat and I'm sorry I'm not trying to start anything bad but unfortunalty just from all your post which my heart is with you because you are trying so hard, you have all our hearts and best intentions but, it's very difficult for you to " pin " your husband on if he is telling you the truth or not only because of all the questions you are asking, and please don't take this the wrong way.

One of the toughest things we have to ask our selves is or come to the realization is that we maybe an enabaler, being an enabaler means that we have those questions wether our loved one is telling the truth and ususaly giving them the benfit of the doubt.

Meetings backfire as some have said in their posts, and they can be amazing insights dependeing on where you go. I belive in mental strength to fuel physical strength, and you have to have a plan before you start going to meetings because of this fact, and the enabler fact. This way while interveiwning counselors you may see that it  may come down to you having to make some very tough decisions and you may need all your strength to either work on aplan or put your foot down.

It's a hard road, with hard decisions to get some very hard results but you have to educate your self, this is why it's not just your husbands problem, for you to stay together you also need help, and untill you educate yourself and come to this understanding it's going to be a even harder road.

Find A good Counselor, tell them the truth, the real truth no holds barred, because if you don't it will never work, better yet write it down so when you go in there you won't forget anything, at this point when your telling someone who is nuetrual, and if your husband deny's it, then you'll have ypur answer, or maybe he will say we need more help and suprise everyone. It's so hard to say I need help but sometimes when you know it and you feel that evryone is there to help they may just ask for it.

My heart is with you, all our hearts are with you, the above people have given some great from the heart advise, and again I appologize I'm not any better than every one person on this site, sometimes i have a hard time on posting becasue it is so impersonal, thats why I stay in lurker land

Big Mike

[Fergman]

I tried to find your last post............can you direct me?  Just remember, you are not alone!!!!!  I am here for you, and if you need to private message me, do so.  Now.  Please.

[worried878]

thing is....for a while after quitting i was real "gun-ho"..then the excitement of quitting wears off....and it becomes a thing of the past...God made us I think to kinda forget painful experiences..later the addiction doesnt seem so awful anymore...not like it did when u were in the middle of it...the depression can take 90 days to years for some  to lift until the brain heals somewhat....and boom!  relapse when u least expect it..can be a trigger like stress at work...or may be due to feeling tired, unmotivated or depressed...usually people crave for a bit before they relapse...sometimes it just happens in a few moments time...u think about it, u get em, u take em and u have screwed up...or u get em and take em and make the mistake of thinking u can control ur intake..u make the mistake of thinking u r like everyone else (not addicts included in everyone else)..not everyone who take narcotics has this problem with addiction...but one u have it..u have it   and it aint going no where...u r stuck with it...i am not sure but most can not go back to taking them as prescribed once addicted...anyway...that is why aftercare is important for me

[bravobreeseff]

I have a friend who says the same thing. meetings make her want to use because she hears about all the stories and drug abuse that people went through and she says after she goes she always wants to use because even hearing about how horrible drugs are glorified it to her (this is because a lot of drug addicts are addicted to the pain and torture drugs to do them physically and emotionally. its self mutilation, in a sense.) she didnt go to meetings and has been sober for a year and a half. what she did instead when she craved she had this routine of going to the mall and just browsing every store until whatever free time she has is up. this was her therapy. she wouldnt even bring money with her (so she doesnt get addicted to shopping she said lol) just wander around and looked at things. it worked for her. it probably wouldnt work for me, but it worked. everyone is different.

even when i go to meetings it sometimes makes me feel like using again. some people just need to stay away from it completely, mentally and physically. some need to be connected to it mentally so they dont forget why they quit. each to their own, i suppose.

basically, while NA might not be helpful to him, there needs to be SOMETHING he can lean on when those cravings start to creep again. whether its exercise, counceling, or just going out with friends to do sober things. figure a plan that works for him

[sna103079]

thanks Fergman! you are always helpful... if you wouldn't mind, read my last post in "Duration of Withdraws". I'm having a really bad day today...

[Fergman]

hey, you................try not to listen to folks who put things in capitals........recovery is very personal and should be that way.  You, my dear, have a very tough situation on hand.  there will be a tendency to minimize the situation.  don't let that happen!!!  if you want your man back, do not try to change him.  Have that "one" conversation with him and then watch...................is he true or is he a liar.  I know that sounds cold, but since we've been posting for awhile now I know you're open to advice from experience.  Be strong!

[D154]

YES!!!! Not going to meetings is not  good for someone in recovery. If he doesnt relate to anyone at that meeting then go to a different one. Recovery is a process, it takes time, He must be willing to do whatever it takes to get sober. No one can make him do it, he MUST want to get clean. He needs to find a meeting where people have similar stories like  him, they are out there i promise, he also needs to get a sponsor and start working steps, it will be the best experience hes ever had...GUARANTEED!!!!!! He has to get honest, openminded , and willing...Good luck

[sna103079]

Thanks everyone! I do think he is using me as his therapy but the only knowledge I have is what I get from all of you here. I certainly can not relate because I'm not an addict.

[liscamdave]

No, it doesn't mean he will definitely relapse, but the odds are against him. Aftercare is vital in recovery. In my eyes, its staying clean that is the challenge...and if he wants it, he will do it, but having people to relate to you, helps, and having people to talk to about it that know what you are going through, helps...Knowledge is power..and that is all he stands to gain from going to meetings. So to answer you again, no...he won't most certainly relapse, but his chances are greater without any sort of aftercare. Even this forum is good aftercare...

Good Luck..

[worried878]

men can be funny about thinking they can do all by themselves!  at least in my experience...they dont know how to ask for directions or ask for help!  He does need support..even the forum...something tho for long term clean time...not saying he will for sure relapse if he does not seek support..everyone is different...perhaps he is looking to u for support....he needs to educate himself on every aspect of addiction..the NA book would be a good read for him and u can get it online...END Your Addiction Now was an eye opener for me..atleast he can read if he will not go in person...there are also online meetings available

[Cupp78]

I agree with avis...you have to do something to stay clean.  You can't do it on your own.  That's how most of us got in this mess.  We thought we could fix things ourselves, and drugs seemed like a good way to do it.  I personally go to NA, but don't think it is the be all, end all.  My group has helped me to be able to open up and be completely honest about my problems.  They all understand and have empathy because they have all been there before.  I think that every addict needs some type of aftercare to help make sure they don't get complacent and don't slip back into the old ways of **** things.  I don't have any stats, but I bet that very few make a celan break without some serious help.

[ochooked]

Yes, I totally agree --- If he doesn't want to go to meetings or can't relate to them for whatever reason, then there needs to be a Plan B ----  Ask him to make one- --- an addiction counselor - psychologist, etc.  All the best.

[avisg]

I think if you don't get some type of recovery care your chances of relapse are VERY high ... I don't agree that it has to be a meeting  just something. I don't do meeting's. I see a therapist. She is very knowledgeable in addiction. I know some people that see the pastor and for some aa or na works great for them .It is all about what is the best chioce for you but YES I think too stay clean long term you need something.

[Fergman]

Glad to see you back posting!  One thing I'm sure you already understand is that you can't force him to do anything.  He'll dig in his heels if you do.  Just one time and one time only sit down with him and ask him what his plan for his recovery entails, i.e., meetings, counseling, therapist or whatever.  He needs to know that he has to talk to somebody about his addiction.  Remember, the drugs are there just as a mask to his real problems, and you can't let him off the hook.  I don't know you or him personally but I do know from what you've described that he's full blown in his addiction.
Groups are nothing more than therapy.  I would be very careful if he discontinues working a plan.  

[empathy323]

I have heard some say that talking about all of the negative or even hearing old using stories makes them want to use.  I have heard people say they have to leave this site after awhile too because they fear the constant reminders may harm their sobriety.  Then there are those that the more meetings and more things they participate in the better they are.  I think everyone is different in that respect.  I would say the important thing to look for more than meeting attendance is that the person is not forgetting where they came from.  As long as they know how hard it was to get clean and remember that they never want to go back to that place again that is the most important thing in my opinion.  How they stay clean can be as varied as the ways people get clean.

[cathy5841]

humm, i dont thinkit has to mean he headed for relapse.  i think it means he has not found the right meeting.  maybe he could go to a different meeting.  or maybe an addicyion counsellor.  it is really helpful to get to the root of why you use.  and it is important to learn new tools to help you stay clean.  will he come on the sight and read?? that would be a good support for him also.  good luck to you both.