Oramorph withdrawal

[Muppetmania]

Hi - I have been on liquid oramorph for over 12 months. I've never measured the dose just swigged a bit out of the bottle - well I needed more and more to get rid of pain so am now taking virtually 1 500 ml bottle a day - I don't get high off it at all but I feel anxious if I don't take it. It's not helping the pain (I'm actually in pain everywhere which I think may be withdrawal as I don't take regular doses I just have a couple of swigs whenever I think about it so there's no times for doseage)

I'm also on codeine and tramadol - I need to stay on the codeine regularly and maybe a couple of tramadol a day or on days when pain is really bad.

I do have some MST slow release tablets which I could take to maybe ease the withdrawal?

What's the best way to withdraw?

I thought about cutting it down to half a bottle a day first ?

Please help

[weaver71]

It is a bit of trial and error, but your new plan sounds good, give it a shot. As long as you are reducing and moving forward, you are doing it right. I think it is better to stay at a dose until one adjusts, rather than go up from tapering too fast. You might have to change your routine, put the liquid away from the other meds, to avoid this primal instincts. Maybe put it somewhere you have to think about it to drink it. Right upon awakening, is not a good time to trust our judgement. I even brushed my teeth with my other hand to get out of my habits.  I'm glad you found us too, keep posting and moving forward.

[Muppetmania]

Weaver 71 - I would never dislike someone due to addiction - everyone is addicted to something it's just some of us are addicted to things that are hard Erica to stop than others?

My problem is I do suffer a lot of pain my surgeon once said that Crohns sufferers have a very low tolerance to pain and a high tolerance to pain meds.


When I have surgery I have to have double the normal IV dose of morphine.

I do feel empowered by coming on here and admitting I am an addict and it has to stop.

[Muppetmania]

Well I messed up first thing this morning! Woke at 6 as usual - got my meds out of tablet organiser and swigged out of the oramorph to swallow them - totally forgetting I was only having 200 ml today so I've had to take more than the planned 200 - also thought dropping from 500ml to 200ml was a bit fast so I'm going with 250 a day for 4 days then drop 50 every 4 days?
I'm constantly thinking about it - it's more of a psychological thing than physical I think (although obviously there will be physical withdrawal)

My plan is to be off it totally in 3 weeks - does that sound achievable?

[Merri123]

There you go!!!  You said it. Not so bad. 1ststep is admitting you have a problem.

[weaver71]

In one of my first AA meetings, when I was still embarrassed to tell anyone, a guy told me something I have been repeating ever since. Recovering addicts are some of the kindest, caring, generous, genuine, humble, loving people on the planet. I saw he was right, I think it's because their hearts are so big they want to escape this world as it is. I think that was part of it for me anyway. Doctors, lawyers, bankers, bikers, gangsters, addiction has no prejudice. My doctor/dealer was addicted to the same thing as me. He has a park in the center of town honoring him. He changed this whole town for the better, but he got addicted too. It's not as big a deal as we think it is often times, telling people I mean, addiction is a big deal. You saying that you're addicted makes me feel like you can accept me too, I'm definitely an addict, and a nice guy also. Addiction doesn't make you a bad person.

[Muppetmania]

Thanks everyone for your input. I can't take NSAIDs due to the Crohns.

I need the codeine to slow my bowels down, then tram for pain.

The oramorph doesn't do much for the pain to be honest - I am addicted to it though. There I've said it!

I can't tell anyone in real life as all my family and friends have been so supportive with my illness I don't want to give them extra worry.

Hopefully you guys can keep me on track - I feel much more positive having found you and opened up and got non judgemental replies.

Thanks so much

[weaver71]

"We are only as sick as our secrets." I found it very hard to tell people, but I got to desperate not to. I was surprised at how supportive everyone has been, they all had personal stories or family that they saw this happen to. It sounds like you are seeing addictive behavior in yourself or do you think it is only physical dependance? The pain is serious, I have scoliosis and degenerative arthritis, but I have less pain now off all opiates that I had the last years on methadone. I don't know your diet, but I encourage you to avoid caffeine, refined sugar, red meat and junk food of any kind. Whole grains, fresh veggies, lean protein like chicken, fish is the best imo. A protein shake has the amino acids your brain needs to heal, cal/mag/zinc and potassium help with cramps and RLS, EmergenC drink powder is packed with electrolytes, B vitamins, minerals, and helps me to drink more, I dilute one into a quart and sometimes 2. Epsom salts baths as hot as you can stand it detox, relax, and put magnesium in your muscles. Drink tons of water and try to keep moving through the day, walk or swim, anything to pick your heart rate up a little. I would follow your plan and play it by ear a little toward the end. I would also be thinking of who you could tell locally, it makes it even more real than sharing here. Keep us posted and keep moving forward.  

[Merri123]

Ok sorry my autocorrect on my phone went nuts above. Teams is trams. Hope it makes sense.

[Merri123]

I too amverytiredall the time. Ihate noticed though as I have gotten low on my taker that I am not as much. On the weekends I'll awake at 8/9am fine where I could sleep till noon if I want it is not bc I am so tired now. It is weird to know I can get up so early if I choose.

We can't give taper instructions but what you are stating sounds good. And no more taking a swig as you go by.  That is the demon of liquid drugs - it is easy to take a drink.  So start measuring it out so you don't go through it all in the morning. As you taper you will feel tired, in pain, stomach issues, maybe diahhria, headaches.  You can do it though. Stay on your schedule.

Can you lock the bottles in a box or safe etc? Then you really have to think about getting the keys unlocking it to get to it. It will be a good deterrent plus a way to let your brain say NO.

As Stated above you will feel more pain through this but when you are fine with it and leveled out in a couple if weeks you will know what is pain and what is pills more. Maybe them you can reevaluate what you are taking. Do you need teams for this, codeine for that? Or can one medicine help at regular intervals?  Maybe then an NSAID would work for your joint pain. Like Aleve.

Get vitamin C powder and take that several times a day. Look at the Thomas recipe. Get epson salts for a hot bath. Heating pad or electric blanket. Baths etc will help with the wd pain and help you start distinguishing them. It has helped me figure mine out a lot better as I have done my taper.

You'll be ok. Don't be afraid of the wds. You deal with a lot. A month or 2 to a better life makes it all worth it!!

[Muppetmania]

I've measured 200ml into 2 bottles - I don't take a full 500 ml bottle every day it varies from 300-500.

If I drop to 250 for 4 days, 200 for 4 days, 150, 100,50,25 stop does that sound achievable? I have malabsorption of my short bowel so sometimes I'm not even absorbing the full amount? I tend to just take a swig every half hour or so until the pain eases a bit then just have a swig when I walk past the bottle.

I am not functioning properly and can have conversations and not remember them, I just want to sleep all the time- I  determined to get off this **** - I just need help - thanks for our input - just telling you lot has helped as no-one knows its a problem.

[Muppetmania]

Thanks for your replies - I have severe Crohn's disease, an ileostomy and rheumatoid arthritis - I'm wondering how much of the pain in my joints is due to the oramorph? I don't take a set amount at a set time so I am theoretically withdrawing at some times each day - I will pour a days worth into a bottle ( say half a bottle per day for a week then drop 100 ml?) I need codeine high dose to slow my stoma output down  and them tramadol for joint pain - I do have diazepam which I could take if it gets really bad?
What kind of symptoms am I looking at? I have been putting my chronic fatigue down to the disease but I think it's actually the morphine?

[weaver71]

With the morphine being stronger than the other 2 meds, they will likely not help, if you can tell you took them at all. Tapering would make it easier, but opiate induced hyper-analgesia will make fantom pain in withdrawal. Most of us keep taking meds from this pain, it takes a while to finally get to the base real pain levels. I'm not sure how that would work with the codeine and trams still in play. I like the advice above, I never counted how much methadone I took, so I know how fast it can escalate. If you don't mind me asking, what is causing your pain?

[Merri123]

If you can taper down the bottle till you stop using it, thst will help a lot. But do to increase the others to compensate. Also, try measuring it out so you know exactly what you are taking.

What is MST?