HELP! 6 year old refusing to potty train!

[laci25]

My friend has 6 year old twin girls and a 4 year old son.  She has gotten one of her twins and her 4 year old potty trained but the other twin still refuses to potty train and still wears a pull up.  I have suggested to her to just put her in panties because she probably has it in her mind that she can go in the pull up without having to go to the bathroom.  I have babysat her for the past two days and it has been a major struggle trying to get her to use the potty!  I even tried the panties but she would still go number 2 in them.  I can tell also that she gets embarrassed when other people or kids know she messed her pants.  I don't know what else to try, does anyone have any ideas???

[specialmom]

It would be hard to stand back and watch.  If your gut says something is wrong like neglect, please do not be afraid to report it.  Not to be a horrible friend but to help the kids.  Your friend might benefit from some extra help.  

Anyway, I think your heart seems in the right place and will also keep my fingers crossed for the family and that they can function normally in the near future.  peace and luck to you

[laci25]

She did say she is going to talk to the school nurse before she puts her in school so that is good.  I just hope they get the help they need and are able to be a functional family.

[Sandman2]

     It is wonderful that you feel for this family.  I think that the best thing you can do is to suggest to the mom to contact the local school district and get some help.  The fact that they have been going to a therapist would indicate that the mom knows there is a problem.  The last thing the mom should want to do is to drop her child into the first day of school without any preparation by the school.

[laci25]

The mom speaks as if she is trying to find a way to get her daughter to potty train and even asks for suggestions.  Now, I don't know about their past (for the 6 year old as I've only known them for less than a year) but the mom, for some reason, thinks it is some sort of psychological issue.  She has been taking her to a therapist but has not gotten anywhere with it.  Supposedly the therapist was just always questioning and criticizing the mother's choices.  To be honest, I have questioned a lot of the mother's choices in what she does with the kids, not necessarily verbally but mostly in my mind.  Again, I don't want to step on toes by asking too many questions.  I will say from my observation and from what I have heard from the mom, I think she needs a lot of help herself in parenting.  She is not consistent at all and when her kids whine at her, she just whines back instead of taking charge.  
I know I can't do much to help the mom and they are also moving 4 hours away from their current home so I won't be seeing much, if any, of them after this week.  I just worry about the kids (naturally bc I'm a mom) and I almost wish they weren't going because I would love to be an influence on the mom and be able to help her and encourage her to get help for her daughter and herself.  She really does need help and I know I can't give her but so much.  It's just difficult when you know the child can't help what they are going through and the mom doesn't seem to care either, in a sense.  I honestly think it could be a physical issue like a back up in her system.  She is a very tiny girl and has a slightly distended stomach (almost like a child you would see overseas who is starving).  She seems to be a good eater though but I do know the mom does not give them good nutritious meals.  One day that I watched them, she gave them applesauce for breakfast and that was it.  She has also spoken of them eating Ice cream and junk for dinner instead of a meal.  I really think her daughter's bathroom habits would change drastically if she had a diet that was high in fiber, but her being the mom doesn't want to admit she is not doing right for her kids.

[Sandman2]

   Something weird going on here.  In Virginia the cutoff date for kindergarten is 5 by sept.  The kids should have been in school for at least a year.   It does sound like there is some developmental issue going on here.  What the mother should do is to contact the special education section of her school district and let them know what is going on.  You don't want a child entering school as a 6 year old with these problems.   Furthermore, I would think that the school would like a little advance warning.

[specialmom]

Well, America is where I live.

anyhoo, It is very difficult to help a friend with their kids when they aren't wanting the help.  Like all other things, it can backfire and the friendship goes sour.  

I do feel bad for her kids as she seems to be a bit lost.  Hopefully being in school will have the advantage of other eyes on these kids if you know what I mean.  

I guess I'd just be encouraging to her trying to help if you can but don't make it take over the friendship.  

Let me just say one thing.  If you feel these kids are being neglected, ugh.  You'd have no other choice but to report it.  You can do so anonymously.  

You hate to think of that but sometimes that is the best thing.  She then may be required to take a parenting class and get some counseling.  
Peace and it is good that your heart is in the right place.  But sadly, you have no control.  

[allmymarbles]

American averages may be high in terms of world practices. Americans have a tendency to be permissive.

[laci25]

I have tried my best to talk to the mom in a way that I'm not being cruel.  I don't want her to get mad, but I have told her that I could not stand there and just let my child hit me or let my kids yell at me and demand things from me.  We have taught our kids to say yes mam, no mam, yes sir and no sir.  They wouldn't even think to yell or make demands at us and definitely not hit us!  I told her I don't understand how she hasn't gone insane letting them do that.  She said she just ignores them.  Again, I don't want to step on her toes but that is also another reason I did not offer to babysit her kids on a regular basis.  I asked her what she was going to do about school since she's not potty trained and she said the school is just gonna have to deal with it bc she will be 7 in Jan and by law she HAS to go to school.  I found that as a transfer of responsibility from herself to the school.  She said it almost as if to say "they don't have a choice but to deal with it".  I don't know, I'm just worried about that whole family to be honest.  She is a single mom with 3 kids.  I know that is difficult but I did tell her she is going to drive herself nuts if she doesn't start disciplining and doing something about her children.

[allmymarbles]

From what you say it would appear that the real problem is a negligent mother, not potty training.

[specialmom]

My kids potty trained older.  One son was three and the other was 4.  Just how it worked out.  The average age of potty training in the US is 3.5.  

But, really, as a friend, it will be difficult for you to do much.  I don't really understand the 'filled up" situation.  One of my kids had constipation that was atypical for what you might think of with consitipation.  He did have daily bowel movements.  But became backed up to the point of almost having a blockage.  He had an enema at the hospital (which a child can have at home) and then we moniter his diet.  

Perhaps this little girl does have something called 'encropsis"??  With that, many kids do have bm accidents.  

does she use the potty to urninate?  

But again, this is tough because while you can talk to the mom about it, she's making the call abotu what to do.  Sad  I'm sure this is humiliating for the little girl (as at 6, not being potty trained is a big difference from all the other kids.)

[laci25]

My kids were also trained at 2 years old.  I know that her 4 year old just recently potty trained (and to me that is still too old).  I don't know how old the other twin was when she potty trained.  The mom honestly needs help in her disciplining.  She doesn't discipline at all.  Her 4 year old son, when he gets mad will start consistently hitting her and she will just stand there and ignore him.  All of the kids whine and yell at her and demand things from her and she might say no at first but will give in when they keep on.  The 6 year old that is not potty trained was not put in school this past year so she hasn't experienced that type of situation yet except for being with a babysitter.  I don't babysit them on a regular basis because I just can't bring myself to being ok with changing a 6 year olds diaper.  I figured out just from the past two days of watching her that she has to have some sort of medical problem so I asked the mom about it.  The little girl has a slightly protruding belly and her mom said that the doctor told her that was because she is full of waste, but all the dr said about it is they don't know why.  I told her she NEEDs to take her somewhere else and get her checked out because it is dangerous for her to have waste built up like that in her system and no way to get it out.  She just said, yeah I know  I am honestly worried that mom doesn't think enough of the situation to really take her to another dr!

[allmymarbles]

I get the impression that the other two were also late to train, although not as late. That makes me think the training is off in some way. What is the mother's attitude toward the twin? And how does she react when she soils herself? Is she consistent in her requirements? What happens at school? What about the teacher and the other students?

My girls were trained (daytime) at 18 months and my boy at two years. No fuss. No drama. No punishments. No rewards. Just consistency.

[mummytokailub]

seek professional help my 3 yr old was toilet trained by 16 months and bed trained by 17 months that is too old to be like that makes you wonder is there something going on in her life to make her upset that she does that ? being bullied ? scared at home ? or mental problem? bless her she needs help

[specialmom]

Well, maybe there is something you do not know about her such as a developmental issue.   ???  Most kids are potty trained by 6, for sure.  

All you can do is remind her on a schedule every 45 minutes to go to the bathroom.  make them all do it so she isn't singled out.  Everyone takes a turn (as disruptive as this sounds).  

But as the babysitter/friend, this is really her mom's job to solve.  I'd ask mom what you can do to help when you watch them and if she doesn't have any suggestions, be a friend of the family but don't babysit.  
good luck