My 4 yr old daughter is out of control

[mummabear31]

I am at wits end and don't know what to do anymore. My 4 yr old daughter screams and chucks the worst tantrums when she doesn't get her own way, she doesn't listen to anything I say and I'm afraid that when my baby is born it's going to get worse. I have tried coming down to her level and talking to her, naughty corner, have taken all toys out of her room, have tried taking her favourite toys off her but nothing works!  It's almost like she doesn't understand why she's in trouble even though I have explained it to her as simple as possible.  Are there any other ways of discipline because I don't know what else to do and I'm starting to think that this is not normal 4 yr old behaviour

[Sandman2]

   Very good points by Rockrose.  Tantrums are different. And need to be treated differently.

[RockRose]

I agree with what Sandman has said,  as usual.

But I wonder the degree of her tantrums.  Massacheussets General Hospital Neurology Dept had an online forum where they discussed the possibility that severe tantrums in small children could possibly be a type of seizure.  Brain activity during severe,  prolonged tantrums seemed to mimic seizure brain activity in studies,  especially when tantrums seem a little unpredictable.  

With tantrums,  it seems there are three kinds.  One,  a normal outlet of frustration that the child is just so aggravated and frustrated that they can't help but express it in screaming and flailing around because they're too immature to calm themselves down.  Typical 2 year old stuff.  These tantrums are normal,  and even if the child gets what he seemed to want,  they don't stop all that quickly because there is a lot of passion behind it.  

Second,  is a tantrum designed to manipulate a parent/caregiver into giving in to the desires of the child.  Those tantrums are triggered by a distinct request,  and if the request is filled,  the tantrum stops immediately and the child is happy.    

Third,  a tantrum that goes on and on and on,  lasting over 15 minutes or so,  as much as an hour or so,  that doesn't seem to be clearly related to anything and there is nothing at all that can be done to make the child happy again.  The child may be pointing at a specific desire,  but if that is offered,  it doesn't stop the tantrum.  Those are the kind that are linked to seizure like activity.  

So.  If you have a child in the second category,  and she is using screaming and flailing to get her desired request,  that's the easiest to "fix".
All you have to do,  is never allow the child to receive what they want and request through a tantrum.  "You will not get what you are screaming for.  If you ask in a nice and reasonable way,  you will be likely to get what you ask for".  And then,  make that true.  Make it true that if she asks nicely,  she's likely to get at least a portion of her request.  

Best wishes.

[Sandman2]

      Well, maybe not quite normal, but I have seen that exact same title enough times on this forum to know that it is much more common then you would think.
      Do realize that some of this may be due to your new addition coming.  I am sure that you probably have not been able to spend as much time with her now as say a year ago.  But, ya, this is something that you need to deal with now and not when the new little one is here.
       But mainly don't, "spend a large portion of my day saying "the way you are acting is why we aren't (insert whatever activity here)" and she doesn't seem to get that... "  Talking to her just will not work.  And talking to her when she is having a tantrum - won't work.
   The rule is that when she starts a tantrum - she gets a short timeout.  And the timeout does not start until the tantrum stops.  She will go nuts for a while.  Just keep repeating - "as soon as you choose to stop your tantrum, the timeout will start and 2 min later you can ..."   Do not try to reason with her or talk with her while  she is yelling.  You are just playing into her hands.
  Essentially, the rules for behavior modification are that there must be immediate, short, consistent consequences.   Do not expect overnight miracles.  It has taken her awhile to get to this point and it will take a while to relearn control.  But she will.   A really good book which gets into a lot of detail in using this system is "SOS Help for Parents," by Lynn Clark.
   Finally I am providing a link that we did back in January.  There are a lot of very good ideas that will help you.   Read all of them.  While some don't exactly apply to your situation, the answers will.
      The link is - http://www.medhelp.org/posts/Child-Behavior/4-year-old-son/show/2423496
      Please post if you have any questions about any of this or the other link provided.