Aa
at wits end
My daughter is nearly 8 and her behaviour seems to be getting worse.At school she is very very shy and quiet,she prefers to play on her own but is doing well in all subjects,however at home she can be a nightmare.I never know when she is going to kick off,it could be over the slightest thing,like she has made a mistake on a drawing,she dosen't listen to me and is rude and disrespectful,every day she throws a tantrum at least once,I send her to her room but she dosen't care and will just play.All my neighbours must here is her shouting.She is going to be assessed for asbergers after I went to the doctor but can't help feeling im doing something wrong.Some days I jist sit and cry.She can however be lovely but is so unpredictable,I feel like im treading on egg shells.Help!
We can't say there is nothing wrong whith the OP's daughter. That's what the professional are for (thank GOD). While I understand what you're saying as far as your story, maybe if you were given some help, as in professionally, you wouldn't have struggled like you did. It's normal for children to have anxiety in school, but to burst out in tears when called upon? That really indicated a bigger problem, IMO, and it's kind of sad no one intervened on your behalf. Maybe if they did, you wouldn't have to resort to being passive aggressive as a coping mechanism.
Also, holding a child back certainly is hard to do...you worry about social ramifications, etc...but honestly, what is even WORSE is sending a child on to a grade they're just not ready for, academically, socially, etc. The last thing we should do to a child is make things even HARDER for them, especially when they're already struggling. That leads to poor self esteem issues, because the child feels like they don't make the cut, they feel "stupid", and it shouldn't be that way.
Thank GOD this Mom is open minded and willing to explore what's going on with her daughter, rather than sweeping it under the rug, or just chalking it up to a "stage".
Who knows what the assessment will show, but that's why we have professionals who know what they're doing, and they have some amazing assessment skills at their disposal to make determinations about what is going on with the child.
"my inner child/emotional self still feels the same way i did all those years ago. i have never been able to move on. anyway, what im trying to say is i really wish my parents had understood that i really needed help. i feel my life would be so much different if i had solved the issues at the time."
EXACTLY. This girl is lucky she has a parent willing to take action, even if that means grade retention. It's very sad you didn't have the same.
Also, holding a child back certainly is hard to do...you worry about social ramifications, etc...but honestly, what is even WORSE is sending a child on to a grade they're just not ready for, academically, socially, etc. The last thing we should do to a child is make things even HARDER for them, especially when they're already struggling. That leads to poor self esteem issues, because the child feels like they don't make the cut, they feel "stupid", and it shouldn't be that way.
Thank GOD this Mom is open minded and willing to explore what's going on with her daughter, rather than sweeping it under the rug, or just chalking it up to a "stage".
Who knows what the assessment will show, but that's why we have professionals who know what they're doing, and they have some amazing assessment skills at their disposal to make determinations about what is going on with the child.
"my inner child/emotional self still feels the same way i did all those years ago. i have never been able to move on. anyway, what im trying to say is i really wish my parents had understood that i really needed help. i feel my life would be so much different if i had solved the issues at the time."
EXACTLY. This girl is lucky she has a parent willing to take action, even if that means grade retention. It's very sad you didn't have the same.
Also, my perfectionistic tendencies made my self esteem problems and social fears, much worse. i did count, i cant remember much else... i still uncovering memories.
hi. this reminds me of myself as a child. im 20 now. i will just tell you what was going on in my mind when i was that age: i was angry and i took it out at home. i physically acted out, and was always having a meltdown. i felt like i had to fight for control because i felt threatened. but at school, i had such severe social phobia, that i was afraid to speak to anyone except for a few close friends. If i was called on in class, i just burst into tears. Since no one knew what to do with me, they did nothing. but i was acting out because i didnt know how to express i needed something that i wasnt getting. this continued till.. now, really. ive learned to be afraid of consequences so i have perfected passive aggressiveness. now everything is a mess and its going to be much much harder to solve. my inner child/emotional self still feels the same way i did all those years ago. i have never been able to move on. anyway, what im trying to say is i really wish my parents had understood that i really needed help. i feel my life would be so much different if i had solved the issues at the time. Honestly, theres nothing "wrong" with her, she just needs something or is experiencing something she cant express. Dont hold her back in school, it will just make the social problems worse.
COMMUNITY LEADER
I completely agree with specialmom. Do not let the school move her up a year! I think the results would not only be in her best interests, but could possibly cost the school a lot of money if she really does have a problem.
I like your point about using wording to get across your ideas. The school is not going to be much help here (hard to believe).
I would suggest you take a look at this site on Autism and see what the symptoms are and how the parents describe them. Then actually write down (really what you have told us) and take that in with you. It is very hard to just orally tell a doctor what is going on. So be prepared and take in a full list of behaviors. The site is here - http://www.medhelp.org/health_pages/Autism/Behavioural-Characteristics-behind-the-Clinical-Diagnosis-of-Autism-ASDs/show/277?cid=73
And please keep us updated and let us know if we can be of help! Best wishes!
I like your point about using wording to get across your ideas. The school is not going to be much help here (hard to believe).
I would suggest you take a look at this site on Autism and see what the symptoms are and how the parents describe them. Then actually write down (really what you have told us) and take that in with you. It is very hard to just orally tell a doctor what is going on. So be prepared and take in a full list of behaviors. The site is here - http://www.medhelp.org/health_pages/Autism/Behavioural-Characteristics-behind-the-Clinical-Diagnosis-of-Autism-ASDs/show/277?cid=73
And please keep us updated and let us know if we can be of help! Best wishes!
Thankyou so much,am so glad to have come on here,also your wording is very good (not very good myself) so will be using words like social/peer interaction to put my views across and be taken more seriously.Will keep you updated,thanks again,best wishes
School is not just about academics in my opinion. The social aspect is so very important as well. So stick to your guns! You are her advocate and hopefully this will not be hard to convince them that her social/peer interaction is critical to her overall comfort level. Lots of luck and let us know how it goes!!
Thankyou,the school really keep on about how she is ready.She is not! All they see is this very quiet little girl who works well and dosen't cause them any bother.Now I have the assessment coming up Im hoping this will back me up.Thanks again for your support!
Sandman will give you more input but i would Not move her up a year. I think your instincts are right about that and I would hold very firm that it would not be in her best interest. The school can't legally force it, don't let them make that decision for you. good luck dear
And yes she has some obessions like lining all her little figures up,in lines or circles,if someone moves any of these figures all hell breaks loose.She also is allways arranging stuff into order,like size or patterns or colours.She has anouther side though.although really shy if anyone talks to her in public,she loves singing really over the top opera voice and she'll do this while walking along not caring that people are looking,she even does arm gestures and everything!Im sure the school don't believe this as she is so so quiet there! sometimes I just can't figure her out!
She is in year 2(uk school) and her birthday is august.She should be in year 3 but instead of starting her when she would have just turned 4 I waited until she was five.I did this because her speech wasn't very good at that point and she is also very tiny.It means she is the oldest in her class,the school wants to move her up a year now but this bothers me.Although she has no best friends in this class she is comfortable in there.She has tried a couple of sessions in year 3 but didn't talk and got really upset about it.The school want to move her up because of funding.it's not because she is excelling.although her maths is great her other subjects are average.her handwriting isn't that great.This has angered me because the school never told me she would suddenly have to jump up a year when I started her.thankyou for your advice
COMMUNITY LEADER
Let us know how the assessment comes out. She does have some obsessive traits which are bothersome. And writing pages and pages of sums does bother me (and I taught math). One thing I forgot to ask is what grade is she in and when is her birthday?
Thankyou,She really does seem to hold it all in at school and then explode as soon as she's off the school bus and out of sight of teachers! Ive noticed how she loves routine and if say I change the route to school she will panic.Am going to take both yours and specialmoms advice,really want to help my daughter to deal with these things.The school dosen't seem concerned but I think that's because she is 'off the rador' there as she is so quiet and as one teacher said 'the perfect pupil to teach'.I voiced my concerns because she was writing pages and pages of sums at home,I even found her sat up one night writing them.She was only just seven and it seemed obsessive.also she counts constantly,everything.The school just said that was really great which of course im pleased she shows interest in maths but it seemed abit much.Really looking forward to my daughter being assessed.thankyou again
Thankyou so much! Im going to try your ideas,thinking about it ,my daughter loves building 'dens' quite often out of sheets and things and will sit quietly under there playing.Ive also noticed she talks in a babylike voice,sometimes for days this is usually when her behaviour is very unpredictable.She seems to enjoy school,she loves the maths and histoty but ive noticed her behaviour is worse,whereas in the hoildays it's alot better.It is like she is holding it all in and then explodes.Thankyou again for your advice,really wasn't having a good day!
COMMUNITY LEADER
Specialmom has a ton of wonderful, workable suggestions. I would add just one or two more.
When you said, "I send her to her room but she dosen't care and will just play." You really don't know if she cares or not. Furthermore, it doesn't matter! What you are doing is trying to change her behavior. It doesn't happen overnight. Many parents will try something a few times and when it doesn't work - give up. The problem is that experts have shown it takes about 3 weeks of consistent, immediate reinforcement to get a behavioral change. Thats 3 weeks - not 3 times.
Another book to look into is love and logic by fay and cline. They will give you a system that (it sounds like) you need. Combine this with all of the great ideas that specialmom gave and I think you will see a change. Just remember, it won't happen overnight.
The other thought is yes, if she has something like Aspergers then how you work with the child will change. But you will also be aware of the things that she can control and not. Sometimes kids do all they can to hold it together at school, and when they get home - they just fall apart. Knowing, understanding that is important and specialmom gave a lot of really wonderful ways to help her (and you) work through this. Best wishes.
When you said, "I send her to her room but she dosen't care and will just play." You really don't know if she cares or not. Furthermore, it doesn't matter! What you are doing is trying to change her behavior. It doesn't happen overnight. Many parents will try something a few times and when it doesn't work - give up. The problem is that experts have shown it takes about 3 weeks of consistent, immediate reinforcement to get a behavioral change. Thats 3 weeks - not 3 times.
Another book to look into is love and logic by fay and cline. They will give you a system that (it sounds like) you need. Combine this with all of the great ideas that specialmom gave and I think you will see a change. Just remember, it won't happen overnight.
The other thought is yes, if she has something like Aspergers then how you work with the child will change. But you will also be aware of the things that she can control and not. Sometimes kids do all they can to hold it together at school, and when they get home - they just fall apart. Knowing, understanding that is important and specialmom gave a lot of really wonderful ways to help her (and you) work through this. Best wishes.
Hi there. Oh, it is hard being a parent sometimes, no doubt. I'm a mom too and I have my more challenging days. I have a son that is also outside the box with moods/regulation of his moods (he has sensory integration disorder) and things can be hard sometimes. He too can be so sweet and darling but then switch and lose control of himself. It actually makes me sad for him as I've discovered he really doesn't want to feel this way or act this way.
One thing I'm wondering about is if you've worked with your daughter on some anger management skills. We can teach our children how to handle their emotions if it doesn't come naturally. This will include giving her language to express herself. If you are evaluating her for aspergers, it is often the case with these kids that their brains do not compute social skills/images the same way. They can not naturally detect facial expressions, tone of voice, or situational responses. You have to teach them that. The first step is identifying emotions. Happy, what makes her happy, how does she feel when she is happy, how does she look when happy (mouth in smile, eyes, bright, relaxed, etc.). Then do sad, mad, frustrated, etc. make it a little project to go through these emotions and chart when they occur for her, how it feels and what she looks like. THEN, talk about emotions of others. Help her understand that what she does to show she is happy in terms of what she says and how she looks is what other people do too. And she should look for that. (basic social skill). This will not only help her with her peers and all she socializes or comes into contact with but also help her in general understand and notice when her own mood is switching.
Then when she is angry, frustrated, etc. (and there are books at the library that discuss these emotions for kids, excellent resource to read with her. Some kids with aspergers like to use code words for emotions as well. Let her evolve in regards to this in her own way) talk about strategies to cope with it. What CAN she do when mad. Many kids do well to go to a quiet, small space (dark is often good). A small pop up tent in your house, a corner under a table, in a rocking chair with a blanket to pull over her head. Really calming to some kids and gives them the opportunity to self soothe. (and by the way, if she is not having emotional issues at school, she may be 'holding it together there' and then imploding/exploding once in her safe place, at home). She can count, deep breath, use a fidget to squeeze. You can use an big exercise ball and play 'steam roller' where she lays face first and you roll the ball over her providing calming deep pressure. So, problem solve with her about things to try, make a list and maybe even with pictures to go with it. Give her these choices as you see her escalating in emotion. That is another critical point, look for triggers. And look for signs that she is becoming angry/sad/frustrated and start the calming strategies then. When she is in full screaming/meltdown mode---- then it is a bit late. Still do the strategies, but it will take longer. Something you can do when she is in that state is offer her a piece of thick bubble gum. That gives calming input to the nervous system for many kids. I carried my 'emergency' pieces of gum for this reason for a long time and actually now, my son who is also 8, carries a piece of gum in his backpack at all times . . . "just in case".
Also, she may be a perfectionist. Sadly, perfectionists are often insecure and believe that the least flaw in something they've done says something about them that is negative. Help her understand this is not the case by making a big deal of failing yourself. Try to draw something and have it turn out really bad and then just talk outloud . . . oh well. It still looks pretty cool, right? Tell her a story of some mistake you made and how it turned out alright. Model that it is okay to not be perfect. Compliment things like the colors she chose in her drawing verses the drawing itself. If that makes sense.
You are doing the best you can as a parent. Cut yourself some slack. It's hard work. And sometimes it is hard to know the best thing to do. Trial and error. So, keep at it.
for screaming, I simply tell my kids that I won't speak to them until they use their talking voice. and then I ignore them. Once they calm down, then I tell them good job calming down and now we can talk.
well, I wish you luck. I'm here any time if you need to vent or chat!
One thing I'm wondering about is if you've worked with your daughter on some anger management skills. We can teach our children how to handle their emotions if it doesn't come naturally. This will include giving her language to express herself. If you are evaluating her for aspergers, it is often the case with these kids that their brains do not compute social skills/images the same way. They can not naturally detect facial expressions, tone of voice, or situational responses. You have to teach them that. The first step is identifying emotions. Happy, what makes her happy, how does she feel when she is happy, how does she look when happy (mouth in smile, eyes, bright, relaxed, etc.). Then do sad, mad, frustrated, etc. make it a little project to go through these emotions and chart when they occur for her, how it feels and what she looks like. THEN, talk about emotions of others. Help her understand that what she does to show she is happy in terms of what she says and how she looks is what other people do too. And she should look for that. (basic social skill). This will not only help her with her peers and all she socializes or comes into contact with but also help her in general understand and notice when her own mood is switching.
Then when she is angry, frustrated, etc. (and there are books at the library that discuss these emotions for kids, excellent resource to read with her. Some kids with aspergers like to use code words for emotions as well. Let her evolve in regards to this in her own way) talk about strategies to cope with it. What CAN she do when mad. Many kids do well to go to a quiet, small space (dark is often good). A small pop up tent in your house, a corner under a table, in a rocking chair with a blanket to pull over her head. Really calming to some kids and gives them the opportunity to self soothe. (and by the way, if she is not having emotional issues at school, she may be 'holding it together there' and then imploding/exploding once in her safe place, at home). She can count, deep breath, use a fidget to squeeze. You can use an big exercise ball and play 'steam roller' where she lays face first and you roll the ball over her providing calming deep pressure. So, problem solve with her about things to try, make a list and maybe even with pictures to go with it. Give her these choices as you see her escalating in emotion. That is another critical point, look for triggers. And look for signs that she is becoming angry/sad/frustrated and start the calming strategies then. When she is in full screaming/meltdown mode---- then it is a bit late. Still do the strategies, but it will take longer. Something you can do when she is in that state is offer her a piece of thick bubble gum. That gives calming input to the nervous system for many kids. I carried my 'emergency' pieces of gum for this reason for a long time and actually now, my son who is also 8, carries a piece of gum in his backpack at all times . . . "just in case".
Also, she may be a perfectionist. Sadly, perfectionists are often insecure and believe that the least flaw in something they've done says something about them that is negative. Help her understand this is not the case by making a big deal of failing yourself. Try to draw something and have it turn out really bad and then just talk outloud . . . oh well. It still looks pretty cool, right? Tell her a story of some mistake you made and how it turned out alright. Model that it is okay to not be perfect. Compliment things like the colors she chose in her drawing verses the drawing itself. If that makes sense.
You are doing the best you can as a parent. Cut yourself some slack. It's hard work. And sometimes it is hard to know the best thing to do. Trial and error. So, keep at it.
for screaming, I simply tell my kids that I won't speak to them until they use their talking voice. and then I ignore them. Once they calm down, then I tell them good job calming down and now we can talk.
well, I wish you luck. I'm here any time if you need to vent or chat!
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