ms hug and thoratic spine

[chinacat65]

Excuse my spelling But I cant find my spell check on this comp. I am wondering is there a link between lesions in the thoratic spine and the MS hug and or issues with urination?

[fdmh]

It's called a dermatome map.  Search that.  I've seen several of them in my EMS training due to trauma.  

[summerluvr]

thanks for the encouragement. Neuro, he is the top doctor at the MS clinic here in Toronto. He questioned if I really was retaining said I needed more tests to prove it (as if we make this stuff up.. haha)   When I questioned at least doing blood tests for thyroid etc he said well first lets wait and see what the MRI says... So they must have some inclining of something going on, but in the meantime you feel like they just downplay everything  and that you are slightly crazy.  I may not have MS, but something is not working somewhere down the line...

I am seeing my urologist next week who says he takes this symptom very serious in young women to work out what to do,  at least try to get the MRI bumped up earlier then August (yes August is when it is scheduled!!). I think I had a UTI a few weeks back that seems to have cleared up.  He told me the back spasm is my kidney.

[essdipity]

Just a comment on where in the 'wiring' there's a glitch when urination becomes a problem:

Since I have this issue, I've read up on it quite a bit. My best information is that the problem can be almost anywhere, from brain right down to where the sacral nerves leave the spinal cord. Urination is a complex function. Signals need to work all the way through the CNS. I would not trust any doctor who insisted that only one site can be the culprit.

As to the MS hug, that does seem simpler. Clearly the problem can't be in the cord below the place where the hug is experienced. Still, that leaves a lot of territory. Also, if muscle spasms are causing the hug feeling, I would think that the issue is different than if the whole thing is a paresthesia. I'm not sure this has been clarified by the neuro establishment. Or possibly there can be various causes.

Summer, don't let your doctor pigeon-hole you like that. That's a sign of narrow thinking and a poor doctor. If you're retaining, that's potentially quite serious, and you need aggressive treatment, not what you're getting from that neuro.

ess

[Sarahsmom46]

My symptoms started with Transverse Myelitis exactly a year ago.  I started out having severe weakness in my right leg and then it went into my left leg.  Then I felt numb from my feet up to my waist.  I was taken to the ER by ambulance and I had 2 episodes of leaking urine during my ER time.  That is how TM started out for me.  

Since then, I have had problems like you are having, more with retaining urine yet feeling like I have to go every 20 minutes.  I also have the MS hug as they call it, pretty frequently.  You just get used to it as so far I haven't heard of a sure fire way to deal with it.  

With that said, you ask if there could be thoracic lesions causing this?  Well, while I was in a clinical study for people with "possible" MS, they saw something on the MRI in my thoracic spine.  They did the MRI again and still could not agree if it is an MS plaque or something else.  Nevertheless, even if they can't "see" the lesion on MRI doesn't mean it is not there.  If you are having clinical signs in this area and bladder issues, then there is definitely something going on in that part of the spine.

I would see a neurosurgeon who specializes in the spine to get a final ruling.  Have you had spinal MRIs yet or other testing that could help explain what is going on here?  It sounds very interesting.  

Julie

[jensequitur]

>  Is this why so many people are in limbo because they dont fit a text book definition ?

Most likely.  Although I think most of the problem with diagnosis is how the neurologist was trained.  A neurologist is still a doctor, even though he's dealing with the central nervous system, rather than the more obvious squishy bits.  A good neurologist will look at the whole patient, and listen to their symptoms.

This is a link to an article about spinal injury.

http://sci.rutgers.edu/forum/showthread.php?t=21893

[summerluvr]

I am dealing with retention.  I saw a urologist who diagnosed this, and he sent me to the neurologist because he thinks MS. Neurologist says no because head MRI is clear.  I have right arm numbness /tremor and right leg weakness. Neuro said my neuro exam was clear (despite hyper reflexes on right side) then asked me If I ever had a spinal injury?  (ummm no).  Then ordered a spinal MRI (couldn't get an appointment until August) and told me to go back to the urologist. At first the incomplete emptying was occasional, but now most days I feel I am not fully emptying, and sometimes get back spasm etc.  

Good luck!  

[chinacat65]

The reason why I asked was because the minute I explained to the neuro about the pain around my chest he asked if I had any bladder problems . I never mentioned that to anyone but my mother and it wasnt a leaking problem but just not being able to empty my bladder completly .  It went away and I never thought much about it.
   He did tell me most people present with ms with tranverse mylitis . Can you explain what that is ? or blindness in one eye for a period of time How many people here who are diagnosed presented this way . Is this why so many people are in limbo because they dont fit a text book definition ?

[Lulu54]

Bladder and bowel issues are definitely associated with spinal lesions.  I believe the hug also originates from the spine, but can't swear to that.

Does anyone know someplace on line that has a graphic of brain/spine connections to body functions?  I saw one once but for the life of me can't find it, and I have looked several times.  

Lu