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Avatar universal

How did your patm start?

I have been suffering from Patm for the last 4 months now and it's making me very depressed and super anxious around people. I can't never be relaxed anymore unless I'm alone and it's driving me crazy. So far I have tried a lot of supplements from vitamins to probiotics but nothing seems to actually cure it. The only thing that helps is not drinking coffee and staying away from things with fragrances on it . I have days when I get not reactions at all and I think I'm cure but as soon as I drink coffee or wear perfume people get sick around me. So how did you realized you have patm? To me it started in February of this year. I went to work just like every other day and suddenly my coworkers started saying that it smelled like garlic around me. That went on for about two more days then suddenly I started smelling way worse like yeast and everyone around me would said "whats that smell" but it really didn't smell that strong to me. So next day I bought a stronger deodorant, wore tons of perfume and took an anti-fungal but I would only smell worse. The more perfume I wore the worst the smell would get. So at the end of the week I went to see my doctor who told me she couldn't find anything wrong with me but she still gave me an antibiotic. As soon as I started using the antibiotic I started noticing people scratching their noses and snezzing around me really bad but at that time i thought it was because i smelled bad. After I was finished with the antibiotic and i was still getting complaints about a smell I took another one an even stronger one which only made the reactions worse. People went from merely scratching their noses to coughing really bad. So I decided to not wear anything with a fragrance on it. That meant not perfumes, or hair products or hand sanitizer. I started wearing only unscented products and suddenly people were not reacting to me as much or complaining about a smell. Now I wonder if I even smelled bad to begin with or was it all just watching all these people scratching their noses that made me believe so. Now I'm starting to believe that this was patm all along and the antibiotics just made it worse. I think people complained about a smell because patm applifies any odor i have so if i smoke I smell crazy bad If i put on even a bit of perfume it smells like i sprayed 10 bottles on me and I just cant understand why. It definitely has to be some sore of fungal overgrowth  and I think It's in my digestive system somewhere 'cause as soon as I eat my patm worsens.
21 Responses
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4274626 tn?1487889732
Mine started after a round of antibiotics when I was 13.  It was a fecal odor for most of my life that usually only came when I was nervous (when I was in school).  It was easier to manage after I stopped eating dairy products when I was 17.  Then it went away for a few years.  When it came back in my mid-20's it came back in the form of PATM.  Every once and a while there is a mild smell, but now it's usually just PATM.  I took a hydrogen breath test and tested positive for methane producing SIBO (small intestinal bacteria overgrowth) recently.  It is really hard to get rid of but I am working at it.  Man do I feel sick!!!  I am on a "low-FODMAP" diet and herbal anti-microbials.  The die off is huge and painful.
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17489628 tn?1458796338
Umm ya.....i would've said the same (cough)...lol jk...appreciate all that ur doin Truth
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Avatar universal
Before the advent of the reaction:
- started smoking;
- eating sweets and fast food;
- drink alcohol every week;
- took a course of antibiotics;
- more than a year had dysbiosis.
Now, a new life began.

Sorry for my English.
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Avatar universal
All these experiences/ incidents have ultimately landed us a deal with this **** patm. How I've survived over the years I don't know.
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Avatar universal
At 17 y.o patm became full blown and very apparent to me. For me there is a faint and sometimes more foul smelling odour. I remember at 18 I decided to go see a dental professional about this. Blew £90 and all I got was "you should see a therapist" before hearing her cough in my face and the people outside reacting to me.  Fast forward five years and I am still dealing with this **** that is patm. I remember feeling very nervous (very sick in your stomach nervous once) at 8 years old and I was myself vomiting. That was in school, though alot of incidents took place at home. But some still in school. These incidents would have me misinterpret myself in seeing myself as a person who doesn't want to or/ smell.
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Avatar universal
My guess is, the molar mass of a PATM compound will be between 40 and 90.
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Avatar universal
Guys thanks.. this is valuable information. I’m collecting all this info so I can sit and analyse case later. You guys rock.
I'm very busy at the moment with work but I'm trying to free up time so I can actually go and test what we have. I'll post details later. I've mailed the Mass Spectrometry Officer at the Research Facility. It turns out I was right on some things and wrong on others. Actually they thought I was some PH.D student from another college so they gave me an annual hefty price…lol. Because I’m not trained in this area I’ll need their staff’s help sample preparation etc. There’s a price for everything. Each sample taken cost differently not including the time slot. I don’t blame them because the facility is pretty good.
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Avatar universal
My patm started 2 ½ yrs ago in a very stressful time, i'm 6 inch tall and never had overweight or underweight+i'm not smoking, or do any other drugs and i pretty much never drink alcohol or coffee.

btw are there any patmers who never ate/drink much or even none dairy?
and is there anybody who has done a small intestine capsule endoscopy who can say that it isn't a parasite/microbe that has damaged our small intestine?

I also noticed recently that i'm a bit allergic to rapseed oil (slight rash) dunno if this has smth to do with my patm but since im feeling better (lower stress lvl, no dairy, more vegetables, special cooking oils) it seems, my patm symptoms are becoming less frequent.
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Avatar universal
I noticed PATM when i 11 year old before that i used to drink coffee and drink sugary drinks. I alsi had a odor that gradually got stronger along with PATM reactions same age.
I was in subway yesterday much loud coughing
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17489628 tn?1458796338
But now MANY ppl react EVERYDAY.  So it seems pretty bad.
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1 Comments
Dj_Choppa,
Thanks for the interesting information. The information about binged drinking and how patm comes on and off is important. It’s intriguing how you mentioned how it starts because I happen to know 3 patmers who have binged drink, bad diet and partied years before getting this. They were OK before that. Two drank strong liquor like hell and take pleasure in fried food a lot. The other was a heavy drinker and preferred junk food like chocolate, ice-cream, sweet and chips. I suggested for them to take L-Glutamine but we haven’t seen each other for years now. I tried contacting them but 2 have moved. The only one left that I have contact with still take L-Glutamine but haven’t stopped drinking or eating junk food. His patm is still there but mild and not like mine when it first started. I should probably call him and inform about Brown Rice Protein Powder.

Here’s the interesting thing about hard liquor. It is by definition a form of antibiotics because it can be derived from a mold that can kill microorganisms. What’s worse it can wear the the gut.

It’s doing the opposite of what L-Glutamine and Brown Rice Amino-Acids is doing.

The interesting bit is Alcohol’s common denominator with ordinary prescription antibiotics that we are aware of. They both are antibiotics and kill bacteria.

There are still puzzles. Here is one. everybody drinks alcohol, why do some people get patm and others don’t. Are we more predisposed to have it or other heavy drinkers have not shared their story yet?

Here’s another. If alcohol kills bacteria, so does saccharomyces boulardii. But alcohol makes it worse but the yeast makes it better. How does that work out?..hehehe. I’m guessing they kill different kind of bacteria. Thanks for the info Dj_Choppa.
17489628 tn?1458796338
Been about 6 months that i RECOGNIZED the reactions i was making ppl have, maybe more like goin on 5 months.  If i would've noticed the reactions i was causing prior to the 5 months than i maybe could have stopped it from getting worse by changing some bad habbits.  I say this cuz i remember only causing a few ppl to react about a yr prior to the 5 months, but i never had reason to believe i was the cause cuz it was very seldom.  The only couple ppl that reacted throughout that year prior to the 5 months had bad allergies  and i just thought it was that.  1 girl from work, and another girl i was friends w outside of work would sneeze her brains out when id pick her up, and i mean EVERYTIME.  She even said that she only sneezed like that when she was around me.  

I was drinkin alot, smoking, and eating whatever.  Ended up getting bad reflux, but thats basically it.  I didnt see ur other questions anywhere, but yes i deviated from my diet, but im getting back on it after i eat some left over food from mothers day today lol.  I worked the whole day so i missed out on all the good food ARGGGG
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Avatar universal
Hey kare_1206,
Your story is interesting, it’s typical of all of us. I took antibiotics in great amounts months before patm started. There are many people that started with the same symptoms after antibiotic dosages but not everybody so I’m curious what is the common denominator for all of us. By reading other similar conditions, take TMAU type 2 or the so-called ORS for example, it starts weeks or months before any noticeable symptoms. That’s why it’s important if we all remembered the events weeks or months before it actually started. You guys have fresher memories than we do.

I’m at work but yesterday, my patm was at its worst since I treated myself with lots of junk food. Today it’s mild, sometimes I can’t even tell.

Regarding the smell, I’m guessing you don’t have odor at all, otherwise the doctor would have noticed. You were right about the antibiotics; it only makes it worse when you take it alone.

However, if you take antibiotics for a whole day (2 tablets every 4-8 hours), let’s say Sunday if you going to work on a Monday, and just before you head out to work on the following day, (6-8 hrs prior to work), take 2 tablets of SP, you’ll be surprised how it almost disappears throughout the day.  I don’t recommend this to anyone as it’s only a temporary measure if you attending an important event. Papaya/pumkin seeds or oregano can be used instead of antibiotics.

I would say following Hopeful1235’s method is rather a better long term option.

If you do remember events months, prior to your patm, please share them. More information might just reveal important things that we may have overlooked.

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Avatar universal
You’ve written that you’ve got it for 4 weeks or 6 months, so I’m assuming you recently just got it and it’s not fully permanent like us so therefore I think you have a better chance of getting rid of it than we do.

Maybe you should follow the strict diet a soon as possible to reverse everything in time. Someone posted years back where their patm would often disappear and back again and if I remember, and he just recently got it. So maybe it's easier for people who just got it to get rid of it as the condition has not fully established itself.

Also, please answer my questions on other posts directed at you. I'm interested in information from sufferers who just recently got it because they have fresher memories of the events that led up just before their condition started to appear. Those reflections will help ultimately on our data collections. Things like, your diet, your environment, the people you hang out with, your previous girl-friends if possible etc. For example, is patm infectious? Perhaps yes but really difficult.

Many sufferers believe it’s caused by gut microbes but there’s a big anomaly that can’t be addressed. Every bug causing disease in the gut is infectious for example, i.e. Clostridium difficile is really difficult to get rid off and infectious at the same time. PATM is hard to get rid off but non-infectious so far.

So getting information from new sufferers like you will help reveal more patterns into this puzzle. I never thought after having it for so many years that it’s possible to control it. But now, I not only control it but am able to bring it down to almost gone through optimization of methods gained from information of members.
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Avatar universal
Sorry dude, didn't meant to do that.
Honestly, we don't know when we'd find a solution yet.
What I'm trying to say is that the longer you have the problem, you'll see your behavior change towards other people. It's like a type behavioral programming. I wasn't aware of this until I read on some forum somewhere where a TMAU patient mentioned how he'd look back at how his behavior changed towards other people over the time.

True, none of us would give up.

From the sound of things, you don't appear to have it as bad as I did when I started so you're doing OK. Maybe it has something to do with the diet. I assume you are eating healthy now but I didn't when I first got it. I was eating dairy like crazy. My died is much better now so it's becoming milder and milder.
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17489628 tn?1458796338
Truth...lol where do i begin w you...thats probably the saddest reply ive seen on this forum..im always positive..if this lasts my whole life than so be it..but ill always have hope until i try every last option available..ive just never been the type of person to have that sort of attitude like its all over...ive heard from many patmers that the beginning is the worst when you go through all the changes in ur life...ya its only been 6 months, but honestly i accepted this after the first 6 weeks...im good, if anything its just another challenge in this short lifetime that im willing to take on...eff it, what else can we do?  Im not gonna mope around and give up.
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Avatar universal
Six months is really a short time, but at least you enjoyed most of your life. If we don't find a solution soon, you'll see your behavior change over the following months and years as you adapt to this condition. It's sad experience.
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Avatar universal
welcome to misery and paranoia, mine started about 6 months ago, keep strong and realize you deserve to be here, there everywhere! i have a feeling this is some kind of test.
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17489628 tn?1458796338
Nope, nothin to do w height.  Im 5'9, and patm came crashing into my life about 6 months ago at the age of 29.  Had a bday in april so im 30 now.  I was 210 lbs 6 months ago, and am now at 176.  I never looked like i was 210 tho cuz i worked out a lot, but aside from patm, i feel great after shaving off over 30 pounds.  

So u and i, kare, are still pretty new to this lifestyle.  I gotta say, i am getting use to it and am more accepting of this lifestyle than i was when it started.  Even tho i am more comfortable now, i still wont stop until im cured.
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Avatar universal
I use to think it has something to do with puberty since I got it around that age but statistics collected from all patmers show that it occurs in any age. It could be caused by many sources... TMAU is caused by both genetics and mutation. There is a possibility that PATM can be caused by both but we don't know that right now. Currently we can't really narrow it down any further. Though data we've collected so far seem to suggest that it's unlikely to be caused by gut bacteria/candida(fungi), we can't totally rule it out. Unless there's a thorough scientific verification, we will never now.
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Avatar universal
No, has nothing to do with height at all. I'm tall. All the other patmers that I know are average.

PATM is either caused by the 3 factors below:
    1. microbes in the gut
    2. mutation
    3. genetic inherited problems that cause dysfunctional enzymes.

PATM has no odor which is why doctors can't understand it.
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Avatar universal
I first started noticing my PATM when I was 13 or 14 - basically the start of puberty (I'm 18 now). I've always had somewhat irregular digestion but I wouldn't say it's anything out of the ordinary. However, I've always been pretty short and I wonder if this is somewhat related to PATM and digestion in any way.

If I can ask, how tall are you guys? I'm 5'5 which seems has always felt shorter than I should have been.
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1 Comments
Mine started around 13-14 too.
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