5 yr old with anger issues at school

[4kidsmom]

My 5 yr old is in kindergarten and has been in trouble almost daily this school year. He is very disrespectful to teachers and principles at school.  He has hit, bit and spit on children and teachers, he has jumped off the toilet in the bathroom at school.  He does not respond well to being told "No" or any other kind of correction.  He will start pitching a tantrum, screaming to the top of his lungs and yelling disrespectful things to his teachers.  He has been sent to LEC (basically in school suspension) about 10 days this year, he has been suspended from school 1 day and kicked off the school bus 2 days.  He is our youngest and our only child that is adopted and we have never had disipline problems from our other 3 children.  His birth mother is bi polar so we don't know if maybe this is playing a role in his behavior problems.  The school counselor suggested ODD.  We have an appointment with a psychiatrist in 2 weeks, but I need help ASAP.  It seems that any disipline that we do at home for his misbehaving at school is not helping matters at all.  We have punished for "Bad Choices" and rewarded for "Good Choices" and nothing has seemed to help. At home he is pretty managable, occasionally he gets upset and doesnt know how to deal with his anger.   Where do we go from here... Should we punish him at night( we do not get home from work until 6 pm) for his bad behavior at school, when sometimes he doesnt even remember what he did?  

[margypops]

That is a thread from last year,.... you may find some help from the Book SOS Help for Parents by Lynn Clark...I have found that mostly the problems stem from an interaction problem with their parents, the above posts tell me a story, check out what is making him act out, what triggers them what happened prior to the behavior,walk in his shoes,  and mostly focus on his positive side and praise him when you see him doing something right.I doubt if he has ADHD if you are concerned about that try him on food supplements experts have shown that a mulitple supplement with anti oxidants, Vit B complex and vit C has the same efficacy as Ritalin.ask his Doctor what he thinks .

[keokabear]

I know exactly what you're dealing with.  My son is four and we dealt with the same issues last year in head start and are 3 days into pre k this year and have have poked 2 little girls with a pencil. He was unable to write his name and it frustrated him.  His daddy has adhd and has had since he was a child.   My mother in law states that this is the same type of behavior he displayed as a child.  However, my son is a pleaser.  He beans when he's done something right.  But...when he gets into "that mood"  he couldn't care less about anyone one or anything.  He totally blacksout.  I've tried every method in the book, they rarely work for more than a week.  Obviously they don't stop his aggression toward others.  I wish I could tell you there's an easy answer, but at least you  know you're not alone.

[Natta1980]

Sounds a lot like my son. Conventional discipline methods did not help. He is not driven to please teachers or parents. We saw the same dynamics - at 3 he was having conflicts with children, now (4.5) - he is having conflicts with teachers and us.
With my son - large group is defenitely an issue - my son's senses get overwhelmed in a large group and he gets distractes; in noisy environments he gets very uptight

babygirl6152 is right - target one thing at a time, pick your battles.

And, for my child, money also did not help (he is a bit yonger though)

His dad has mood regulation disorder, and my mother-in-law claims that my son's behaviors, and even anger outbursts are exactly the same as dad's when he was a child.



Good luck

[4kidsmom]

Hello,
Thank you so much for your input... I feel like I am grasping at straws now... Like we have tried every possible avenue.  We have tried everything from going to bed early(which backfires, b/c the next day he does not want to take a nap and misbehaves then!) to taking away playtime outside(his favorite thing), no T.V. , and for only the worst behavior, spankings.  Nothing seems to faze him.  We PRAISE good behavior!  Even with something as simple as staying up 15 to 20 minutes later ( he loves this because of his older siblings, he feels like a "Big Boy") to letting him pick out a snack at the store.  
This is not the first time that he has been under another adults supervision, he started daycare at 3 yrs old and he went to 4 yr Pre K.  His behavior has gotten progressively worse each yr.  It started out with just the usual 3 yr old defiance, mostly with other kids. Then last yr in pre k he started acting out more, but this yr it is mostly directed to adults.  And he has started with the physical violence against students as well.
Thank you for your imput,
Tammy

[babygirl6152]

he very likely remembers what he did- the fact that you discipline him later is a sign to him that you all are cooperating and trying to see eye to eye with the school- and 5 is old enough to obey and respect others.
What kind of punishment do you use for bad choices? It may not be getting through to him- if it is not harsh enough- strong willed children usually  have one BIG thing they love that you can restrict them from- you just have to find it!
How about for positive reinforcement- if this is given at home- for school time-you are showing him that you agree with the teacher - "I am so proud you behaved today"- let's celebrate that. and my boys responded to money- I know most parents don't want to pay for good behavior but- I am talking pennies here- it also helps mom to see if the child can control the behavior. You don't do it forever- we did it for about a year, then they became self disciplined and motivated to behave on their own.


What will probably happen is you all will start with the big battles- not little things like getting out of line- talking out of turn- but BIG issues like yelling, biting, and disobeying.
Standing on toilets is really not a HUGE deal- ( my opinion)- we didn't ignore it but 5 year olds try this- it's showing he is not able to self discipline yet though. I worked at a school over 20 years- boys tried to do that every year- they usually have 60 seconds where they are not supervised and they go a little wild.

The reason I think you are on the right track with looking outside with a psychiatrist is that he is either a very angry child or very out of control when in a large group. That is possibly why he is easier to manage at home- I imagine you have a good schedule and he can pretty much be secure in what is going to happen next in the day, how many people will be there, etc.
So is this his first chance out of the house to be with other adults? How about in a large group?

drop me a note if you'd like.

[Natta1980]

Hi there


First - let the school track behaviors - what is the trigger, what is the goal....When behaviors happen - transitions, compliance issues, what is the behavior, what is the response. With school, there is a lot more structure, that may be a problem. Speak to his teachers - he may need support to help him with transitions (in our case - visual schedule with words  like "bath", "playtime", "snack" helps).

Get him evaluated by a specialist - mood regulation disorders very often bring an array of challenging behavious with them

How is he with accepting "no" at home? Try "Accepting no" program - he asks for something, food or activity, you offer him equally preffered food activity, then once he is responding well to this change (80% of the time) - move onto the next step - offer activity/food that is less preffered, then once it is accomplished, move onto less preffered alternative. The hardest thing about "Accepting no program" is that if you work, there is just so much time in the day to practice it. You do not want to say "no" all the time, but it still needs to be sufficient amount of "no" between all "yes"......When I did it with my son, many times his requests were reasonable and harmless (healthy snack, or playing with a certain toy, but I still had to practice "no" and offer alternatives). Once he grows older, you can fade out offering alternatives, but at 5 years old, he may have a hard time offering alternative.