Getting some things off my chest

[Marc1955]

I've been following the board pretty actively for the last six weeks with a growing sense of sorrow and frustration. I hope no one interprets these comments as directed against them. I simply wanted to get some things off my chest.

My frustration is this – the fact is, in the vast majority of cases, treatment for Hep C is unbelievably challenging. I know I didn't feel prepared for it. For years, my internist had been saying, "It's no big deal." Along about week 12 when it took me an hour to drag myself out of bed and I lost ten lbs in two weeks, I felt like going back to him and explaining that there was no conceivable way he could do his work if he was undergoing treatment.

I do not feel I was adequately prepared for the challenge. I was briefed by a hepatologist and a np but both only discussed some of the sx in general terms. The Pegasys information site is a joke. It's disgraceful the way they understate the known side effects. Then when I started to experience the side effects and felt a growing sense of desperation, they said, "Oh, yeah, that's about typical." Well, if it's typical, why didn't they prepare me?

I definitely do not feel I have the level of medical monitoring that is appropriate to the challenges of the treatment. I really feel as if I have been left largely on my own.

The fact is that many people will not be able to manage treatment. If you have a psychologically impairment or have a current addiction problem. If you're work and home lives are not supportive and stable, you may just find this impossible to do. But is there any excuse for not educating such people before they start rather than once they are in treatment?

I wish there were a major public relations campaign to explain that treatment for Hep C is hell. I go to an oncologist (separate issue) who says that interferon treatment is harder than chemotherapy. With chemotherapy, you feel bad right after you get an injection but then you have good days. It's possible to stay focused and goal oriented. With interferon, you feel like c**p all the time. And it is easy to lose sight of the goal and feel despondent. And the fact that there is no public awareness of the difficulty of the treatment makes it worse. Even if you tell people you are undergoing treatment, you suffer in silence because no one understands the challenges involved.

I would rather everyone understood that in most cases the treatment is hell and then if it is relatively mild for people all the better. But I am saddened and frustrated every time I read a posting from someone who is just beginning treatment who has clearly not been counseled about the challenges that quite possibly face them.

I would love nothing more than if the people on this board disagreed with me. I'm feeling pretty blue tonight. Thank you for letting me get this off my chest.

[meki]

I actually think you are right on with this letter.

However - I'm going to say something you may NOT like to hear.

Those of us on this board who went through hell getting here  --- those of us who had horrid reactions to the meds --- we are the FAR AND FEW BETWEEN.

You don't go looking for answers - unless you are having problems --- so a lot of us here were looking for the reasons why we were feeling so horrid.

So it seems like a LOT of us had problems... But there are thousands who haven't had a problem --- they just feel kinda bad --- but not horrible.

I, too, was not prepared for the total change --- the total lack of ability to do some things....

I was NOT prepared for the pain.

I was NOT prepared for the brain fog... What a laugh... LMAO --- I now look back at that time frame and wonder what the hell kind of "molasses" I swam through --- and how in the world did I manage to get through it alive?

Anyhow -- yeah --- we are the far and few betweeners...

So hold on --- and remember --- the medical world is out to help --- the best they can...

And the pharmaceutical companies are out to make a buck.

But some of us get better.

I'm getting better --- a year and a half later...

So --- if it can happen to me - it CAN happen to you!

Meki

[lolitriqui]

i had all the sides advertised; not all at the same time but pretty much during TX; i found for me personally it was difficult, but never thought i would have to quit; hey meki, i stopped 2w ago, it took you a year and a half to get back to normal??? explain...please

[Xenigma]

would rather everyone understood that in most cases the treatment is hell
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
IMO- that is not a true statement….
Not everyone goes through hell with tx, albeit it's not a fun time but for most it's manageable.  Most that are here are having problems as Meki said.  Some find there way here to learn all they can, they want to be proactive in their tx which (I believe) is the way it should be- not just for HCV but for whatever your ailment is.

Most of the sx everyone experiences during-tx  I had before tx.  In some way’s I felt better on tx.  That’s also why it’s important to have dr.’s that will handle sx’s of tx and write you rx’s for what ails you during your time on the meds.  (stomach pain, gerd, nausea, anxiety, depression, headaches, bone and muscle pain, sleep, even for getting up in the am)  

Most people only feel flu like symptoms.  Some get hit hard and then there are those in between.  It’s a crapshoot for sure.  

[Trinity4]

Treatment has been tolerable for me.  No AD's, no sleepaides but will if I I have to.  It just hasn't been that way for me.  It's not easy, but I've managed ok so far and worked full time.  Everyone is diffferent.  As Mecki states, she was not prepared.  I WAS prepared to a point and many days during the first months I suffered terribly.  But I knew what was causing it and kept hoping it would pass.  It did.  If my doctor in Atlanta says extend 72 wks I'm ready for that too but it makes me feel sad inside.  For now, fatigue is my biggest complaint.  I will not let this disease get in my head.  
Trinity

[fretboard]

I agree with you totally, in fact I'm in the process of changing who and where I get my tx done as we speak.  There have been a lot of studies done on what you're talking about and yes there are alot of ppl that feel like they are just left out there alone.  Most of these healthcare providers know absolutely nothing about tx other than how it is administered.  Sx's, all they know is what you tell them.  I am still trying to get into a clinical trial b/c that is a study so they track everything and watch you alot closer than most other places.  Don't mis-understand me, I know some really great doctors, but none of them tx HepC, yet.  This is just one of many studies that have been done on patient/doctor communications.  later


Quality-of-life tradeoffs for hepatitis C treatment: do patients and providers agree?

Schackman BR, Teixeira PA, Weitzman G, Mushlin AI, Jacobson IM.
Department of Public Health, Weill Medical College of Cornell University, New York, NY 10021, USA. ***@****

BACKGROUND: The authors investigated differences between how patients and providers evaluate the quality-of-life tradeoffs associated with HCV treatment in computer-assisted interviews. They interviewed 92 treatment-naive HCV patients at gastroenterology, methadone maintenance, and HIV clinics at 3 hospitals in New York City and 23 physicians or nurses experienced in treating HCV at other hospitals in New York City. Subjects completed rating scale and standard gamble evaluations of current health and hypothetical descriptions of HCV symptoms and treatment side effects on a scale from 0 (death or worse than death) to 1 (best possible health). RESULTS: . Treatment side effects were rated worse by patients than providers using the rating scale (moderate side effects 0.42 v. 0.62; severe side effects 0.24 v. 0.40) and standard gamble (moderate side effects 0.61 v. 0.91; severe side effects 0.52 v. 0.75) (all P < or = 0.01). A year of severe side effects was equivalent to 4.1 years of mild HCV symptoms avoided for patients if they returned to their current health after treatment compared with 2.0 years avoided if they achieved average population health. For patients with depression symptoms, HCV treatment with severe side effects had lower value unless it would also improve their current health. CONCLUSIONS: . Patients have more concerns about treatment side effects than providers. Further research is warranted to develop HCV decision aids that elicit patient preferences and to evaluate how improved communication of the risks and benefits of HCV treatment and more effective treatment of depression may alter these preferences.

PMID: 18349430 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

[Kristina538]

I was not prepared - two 20 minute meetings with my med team did not prepare me;  I was told I would be tired lol...  

However, I'm wondering how much they could prepare me - whether explaining it all to me would have made me better prepare or choose not to do this!!!   It strikes me that many who have tx'd for the second time are more prepared for battle than the first.   My nurse seems to have no idea of the sx's apart from what the lab sheet tells her.

I did interferon only 14 years ago and that was hard, but nothing like peg with the riba AND I had a much healthier liver then!!!  I was told that tx was 'much better these days'.  I now realise they were talking about the efficacy, not the sx's (silly me for thinking they were talking about how my body was going to cope, rather than the statistical outcomes of SVR haha!!).

While I'd like to see a better universal support system,  I do realise that some on this site have managed to get good support and it certainly seems to depend on the medical team, the attitude and the rapport.   I felt as though I was given meds, shown the door, and told to come back in  4 weeks!!!  I was told I could work but that 'some people struggle working full-time'...

I opened my meds to find a bold-type "see your Accident and Emergency if any of the following happens" - WOW - I showed my partner and we were both terrified for 4 weeks.  Thank God for this site..   My nurse is speaking to Roche about it - she hadn't known it was in the pack and said it was 'over the top' mmmmm.... It was that piece of paper that prompted me to find out more and researching it all in my first 4 weeks an added stress to the meds (but at least got me my 4 week PCR and kept me busy late at night!!)

I would love to see tx centres where you could choose to stay and be monitored etc for the first 4 weeks plus.   However, as I remind my partner, txing is a cheap option to what we would cost when our health deterioriates;  a number of people don't manage the tx, self-medicate and/or relapse so I can't see to much more money going into it until the better, faster, cheaper drugs come along with SVR for ALL  --  LET IT BE SOON!!!!

(I'd like to think that Natalie would open the door to some fund raising, now that she's experienced some sx's?)

[jmjm530]

You have verbalized many of our thoughts very well. Treatment was no doubt the toughest thing I ever did in my life. I once likened it to dying without the relief of death. Sick as a dog most of the time. Could not work. Lost friends. Alienated from family. Aged me both physically and mentally.

I treated with what I consider a top medical team, but no, I was not prepared for what lay ahead. I pretty much got what you got. A sugar-coated version of what lay ahead.  

And that sugar-coating doesn't stop with the docs. You get it even here, with comments from people like Meki who states in this thread. I guess they think they're being supportive when they make statements like below, but I think they're doing a big disservice both to those going through bad times as well as those who are considering treatment and are looking for objective opnions.
-------------------------------

Meki says:

"..Those of us on this board who went through hell getting here  --- those of us who had horrid reactions to the meds --- we are the FAR AND FEW BETWEEN.

You don't go looking for answers - unless you are having problems --- so a lot of us here were looking for the reasons why we were feeling so horrid..."
----------------------

Meki..are you basing this on some sort of study? How do you know that those of us here are not representative of the HCV population in general? Isn't it possible that many are too sick to post? That those who drop out of treatment simply don't show up any more?

Personally, I arrived here during week 1 of treatment. I didn't arrive because I was having  feeling "horrid" because at week 1 I actually felt not so bad. I arrived here because I was looking for information, like I believe why many arrive here.

Just look at how many show up even *before* treatment begins. They don't feel "horrid". No, I didn't arrive because treatment was intolerable, that just came later with the territiory. A territory as Marc explains that isn't very well mapped out for us.

Of course many will chime in that treatment wasn't so bad. And in fact it isn't bad for many. But again, that just goes to show that this place is well represented. You have those who fly though treatment with very little side effects, those with very manageable problems, and then those with what Meki terms "horrid" problems,  -- although I think that is an overstatement in most cases, but I think we all know what she means.

Meki--- I'm only picking on you because you're the first poster who is expressing this particular thought. That this place is not very representative of the tx population as a whole in terms of side effects.  If you didn't post it, someone else would have because it gets posted every time.

I just don't think you're correct, but I have no studies one way or another to back up my case.  We will have to agree to disagree, I just wonder how you can state what you do with such absolute certainty. That probably bothers me the most.

This will be my last post in this thread cause I made my points and have nothing else to add.

-- Jim

[Rockerforlife]

Sorry to hear you are having a tough time.i do agree with you in saying sometimes it feels like they dont really care that much,thats the kinda feeling ive gotten sometimes from my liver study unit im at....before i started tx back in 2006 ,i asked my doc if i needed to be get prepared for these rescue drugs and he said dont worry about it...i found that kinda weird..but other that that it was ok....but one thing i have to say tho there is not too much they can really do about our sides...its a tough world out there.''''hang in there{""

[Trish77]

You make a good point in that perhaps some people who are having it tough really aren't posting, they've faded back to deal. It's possible that's as true as the statement that people who don't need help aren't posting. I think when that statement gets made, it's us thinking about what motivates us to post and it's usually when we need some information or support, I don't really post when things are going well.  And frankly.. I recall having a private conversation with someone here that I was reluctant to post that my treatment experience was reasonably tolerable because when I did that, I got comments like "I don't know how you're doing it, I can barely hold up my head" and I felt bad.  I had to get over that because I needed support for the issues I WAS having and well, my experience is true and needs to be heard also.  

It's just really hard to know what the overall representation is except that pretty much most people I know who go through treatment have a tough time.  I really don't know anyone who breezed through it.  

And yet, when someone asks "did anyone work through treatment?" alot of people post that they are or did work through treatment.  It's really tough to get a good cross-section.  There seems to be plenty of people who represent across the spectrum.

Jim, your experience was among the toughest I've read here and I think it influences your outlook on all this, which is totally expected.  

I do think people need to be prepared for how tough it can be and I think my doctor's approach was correct when he asked me if I was ready for a year of hell.   I think that's the right way to go and I'm glad he did that.  I've often been alarmed with the candy coating that people arrive here with and then they're absolutely plastered to the wall when the side effects truly set in. That always upsets me to find out how unprepared people have been by their medical team.

Worse than that, to me, is the fact that they weren't told they had options.  Alot of people, including me, were told that the recommendation is that they start treatment right away and I was told that based on my viral load alone and not any biopsy because I hadn't had one yet at that point and my GI was going to treat me based on my viral load only.  If I hadn't kept reading, I wouldn't have landed here and I wouldn't have known any different and wouldn't have gotten the biopsy and would have been really upset to find out later that I had choices.  I see people rushed into a year of treatment as if they MUST do this as soon as possible and that's just not the case.  There is alot of misinformation amongst the medical community out there and it's upsetting.

I don't know what I think about a public information campaign that this treatment is hell, my first reaction is that's overkill and I continue to process on that. I DO want the medical community to get with the program and I think it takes the really good doctors to take responsibility for what they know to educate other GI's in their field to ensure that people with Hep C are getting adequate care.  

This is a really huge topic actually and there is so very much I want to say about this but I have to get to work.

It's a good and important discussion topic, Marc.  

Trish

[jmjm530]

Trish: Jim, your experience was among the toughest I've read here and I think it influences your outlook on all this, which is totally expected.  
-----------------------------------------------------
So much for my last post statement :) I said that because, like Marc, I also just wanted to get things off my chest as this can be an emotional topic here that sometimes goes South. But since it hasn't yet -- gone south that is -- I'd like to answer Trish's thoughtful post, or at least the exerpt above, since it is so personal to me.

Yes, I had it really bad, but I don't consider my experience was not "among the toughest". I did finish treatment and two years later I function pretty much the same as I did before treatment. So, based on what I've read over the years, I'd say many, many, have had it worse than me.

As for knowing a person who was "reluctant to post" because they are doing well -- I'll be there are ten more who are reluctant to post how badly they're doing because they feel it will discourage others from treating. This isn't speculation, but many have posted that is the reason they don't "complain" so much.

As to my experience coloring my outlook, I plead guilty in the sense that all our experiences color our outlook. On the other side -- the tx is manageable crowd -- I often get the feeling that because tx was manageable for them, then it is for everyone. Which just isn't true.

Again, I'm not saying that everyone will have a terrible time with treatment. Just saying that some will and that this place IMO is representative on all  accounts. The good, the bad, and the ugly.

-- Jim

[comeagain]

Thx marc for posting this ,very well formulated, and true in many aspects for me.
My medical team also minimised the tx before and in some point during tx.

It was first when I got some severe sx they admitted that is is a tuff a very tuff tx .

I can relate  to what jm said  "dying without the relief of death".
that is pretty much what this is all about for some of us.

But as I and many with me have stated before, thank God is not like that all the time you get some days of  relief now and then, otherwise this tx shouldn´t have been doable for me.

I also wanna believe the gospel of Jesus Christ that says its only God that is good.
And the only chance for me is to let go of hoping on my self, and cast all my troubles on Him ( I´m talking guilt and existential anquish here ).
In my case it was the mental part that was the worst although severe physical sides aswell.

I think my little fait like a quater of a grain of mustard seed has helped me coping with
my inner darkness that was revealed to me on and by tx.

Thats all I´m gonna say in this matter I´ve made my point I´m not gonna start arguing with anyone on this period, or as Harrybeeds would have said thats MY quote please leave it alone.

ca

PS I´ve got the facit ( my facit) I´ve already been through one tx and my facit says its all worth its making me a little bit of a better person then I was before.

[Trinity4]

I understand both sides here.  My heart goes out to those who suffer so much.  The disruption in the lives of those who are so effected by the side effects must be devastating.  As I have stated, I haven't experienced that.  I'm lucky and I know that.  Please know there have been times when I didn't know what my next move was going to be. There is no way I could have known, regardless of how much I educated myself.  My doctor gave me specifics but at the time, I wasn't experiencing it and it just didn't fully impact on me until I was actually experiencing it.  I now know the true meaning of taking it day by day.  Acutally, today is not such a good day.  My back and neck are killing me and I feel very emotional and weepy.  This too will pass.  When it doesn't pass -  I'm on my way to the doctor for some help.  So far I cope, but there are no guarantees that will be the case next week or next month.  Just like there are no guarantees I will SVR.  
I post if feel good, bad or feel nothing at all.  That helps me more than anything.  
It's an individual experience.  Regardless of the amount of information we arm ourselves with, or how adequate our doctors are about informing us of the potential pitfalls, it's never going to be enough to fully prepare us. Tx is and always will be a unique experience for each of us.
Trinity

[geterdone]

Marc, I hear you, and this time will pass also. 72 weeks of treatment is a lot to contemplate while trying to balance a check book or at least fill it.

Nobody is fully prepared, no matter how much information is given or researched before hand and all the side effects are not known until your in the ring of fire. I know I was totally (shell shocked of what happened in the first 12 weeks of treatment) and unprepared for this journey and carried my bag of hammers during it and then there came a point where you just have to let go and let it run its own course. I agree in part with all the statements made above in that we each have our own unique thresholds while treating and for the most part we are at different stages of the treatment on this site and that is the beauty of it.  

jasper

[jmjm530]

Fret,

Thanks for the study. If confirms that many of us have expressed -- that our providers often don't have a clue how much many of us suffer. Part -- but only part -- of the problem falls with us, at least it did with me. I often intentionally minimized how bad I felt at visits for a couple of reasons. First, I didn't want to be pulled off tx or have my dosage reduced. And second, probably a bit of machismo, especially in light of the fact that the provider in front of you is minimizing things.

Kristina,

Great idea about the hospital in-house option. I could have used that several times during treatment. Don't see if happening though because of costs. What we go through may be like chemo but Hep C patients -- compared to chemo patients -- are still treated like second class citizens by insurance companies, etc, at least as I see it.

-- Jim

[nygirl7]

Marc,

I can agree with you - the doctors do not adequately prepare us for treatment in general mostly because I truly believe THEY HAVE NO IDEA what we go through.  Yes, we are the few and far between but those of us who have difficulty turn around and go to our doctors who mostly look at us like a bunch of hypochondriacs, don't they?

When I had ringing in my ears and kept fainting and couldn't walk ten feet and had trouble just trying to breathe and went in to my GIs office - he sent me for a chest xray and told me to go to an ear nose throat person about the ringing........finally I said can't this be hemotyic anemia? And he THEN discoverdd I had a SIX point drop from 15+ to 9 in just over ten days!  The guy had NO Idea!!!!!!!

Now that is an extremely common side effect and there I was sounding like some know it all begging for procrit.  Why didn't he know that arleady?

By the end of treatment he told me flat out that I knew much more about the disease and it's treatment than he did but he realized he had a lot to learn and it would be helping his future patients. Yeah doc...where's my fee then?

So I agree that most often we are just sent away with their old text book information in our hands and left on our own. We all know how often we see the real doctor on treatment and that is a laugh. Thank God for caring NPs!

That is why I always say WE need to learn about this and any disease that we might get.  It's our body and our repsonbility to make sure our treatment is correct and of the highest order.  It shouldn't have to be that way - but the fact of the matter is that it is.  Not fair but...nobody cares about me more than me and it's therefore my job to make sure what goes on is right.

I wish it weren't so but.........it just is.

[Deb_c430]

You know, I think in some cases and I don't mean anyone here at all,  people convice themselves they are going to have bad sides, so do.  

I know when I treated on Peg and Pyg, I had few sides, except emotional ones.  on pyg I did have low HGB. After a few weeks on both I leveled out, my body adjusted, and while not the most pleasant  experience,  I did it.

I have been lucky though and had good GIs, who paid attention.

But I know there is some awful GIs out there, who haven't a clue,   I think that is why ADVOCATING   for your self is so IMPORTANT. You have to know  what your labs mean, You have to speak up, if they don't want to hear it, get another opionion.   That is your right.

I don't think anyone is ever fully prepared either.   I think we all react different,  we all have different body chemistrys,  pre existing health problems,

It is a tough road for sure,  we do have a bonus, we have each other, for facts and "studies" but for comfort also.

DEb

[orleans]

THIS is why this forum is so important to those who are treating or considering treatment. With out the info gathered here I would have been totally unprepared for this. My sx have been managable ONLY because of the advice and preperation I recieved here. To those that have completed treatment, SVR or not, a heart felt thanks for sticking around and helping. jerry  

[Marc1955]

Here's a little story – as I mentioned in my original post, I also happen to be under the care of an oncologist, a breast specialist of all things though I'm a guy. This morning was an appointment. The woman in front of me was signing in. The receptionist asked her how she was holding up and if she could use anything to eat.

This is not some touchy, feely little clinic but a major research hospital, but they still took the time to make sure this woman, who I assume was undergoing treatment, had adequate nutrition to make it through the visit.

Would it kill our providers and their attendants to offer us a glass of water when we go to the waiting room? Hydrating is very important and a major challenge. Have you ever been offered a glass of water by a medical professional, even someone who supposedly understands this treatment? I'm going to be shocked if anyone says yes. I really think the medical professionals minimize the challenge of the sides for HCV treatment.

Thanks to everyone for your incredibly thoughtful comments and perspectives. It is much easier to feel you have some support and understanding.

[Dragonsly]

I have been offered bottled water on every appointment with my NP....also yogurt with granola when given meds.

[nygirl7]

Nope not as much as a drop.  Ever.  

I learned to carry my own in my bag because it was that crucial to always have around. That first time being unprepared without having water with me was like being in a desert and thinking I wouldn't make it out.

[TeeVee36]

I can relate and agree with you.  I had to think back since I am coming up on 5 mos post tx and have tx amnesia.  I remember in the begining feeling so sick in so many ways and then becoming overwhelmed with every aspect of life while trying to work each day and being mostly terrified/scared to death type of feeling.  I would feel so sick that I got really scared and always felt like I was seconds away from calling 911.  It was pretty 'horrid' to say the least during those moments and yes I felt completely alone and no one can relate EXCEPT people that have completed tx or are currently tx'ing etc. I remember my NP telling me that she had construction workers tx'ing and doing just fine LOL.  The upside to tx is that YOU WILL FINISH IT eventually and live to talk about it.

TV

[R Glass]

“I once likened it to dying without the relief of death”

Best Description I’ve ever Heard

[moahunter]

I found treatment very difficult, from the intial 42c reaction, to the weight loss (50 pounds), and mood swings. At the end of the day though, I have minimal lasting side effects (just a bit of nerve damage). I think there is a tendency to thump our chest and yell out loud "I am so strong, for I did this", but to some extent, I think it is whining / attention seeking, which can mislead those considering treatment. There are lots of horrible things in life, I can't imagine how bad cancer chemo must be (having to face up to a more immediate death risk), or many other conditions. Like a lot of things, the mental attitude of someone going in, is probably as important to how "hard" they consider treatment to have been, as the physical effects themselves.

In saying all of that, I sure hope they come up with a "nicer" treatment soon :-)

[sunqueen]

I'm ashamed to say that there were a few times when I felt so amazingly awful, that I too compared this to feeling like death without dying.

I was very peeved when I got here, week 2 into tx. Every single person involved with my care said "you'll be fine." My GI wouldn't give me a note to get off of the on-call schedule at work the week before tx. She said "you'll be fine." I was supposed to work 40-50 hours a week, be on-call for 60 hours over the weekend and then work 40-50 hours again and be fine? The second week of tx I got FMLA papers from work and *demanded* that they be filled out.

I was never told to start the Riba the morning of tx. I was told by a nurse from Pegasys to take as much Tylenol as I needed and I would be fine. Then I found out that more than 4 per day was dangerous.

*Nothing* prepared me for this. I tried to read about tx before I started but finding out that people were flat for most of tx was more than I could handle. Plus, I spent months going from one test to another before my GI would treat. I had an ultrasound, endoscopy, colonoscopy, sigmoidoscopy, high-contrast CAT, liver bx, retina and psyche exam before my doctor would consider treatment. By the time that 8 months of he!! was over, I was desperate to get this thing out of my body.

I stopped complaining  after the third week. I've missed two days of work because of either violent migraine or wicked diarrhea and too weak to stand. I force myself to get out every day for my job.

I work for a nurse-driven profession. I try to stay out of the office because I'm sick of hearing "how are you? you look great!"  I seriously want to slap someone. I've had to chop off most of my hair, I have reddish black bags under my eyes, I've lost about 20 pounds and there are huge red spots all over my face and body, but hey, I look great.

I'm so glad.

Thank you for letting me vent in your thread and I agree completely. If (and I pray never) I ever have to do this again, I will save like a greedy pig for as long as I can and not deal with this pressure.