ABOUT SUBOXONE ...

[Ginaluv]

I HAVE RECENTLY IN FEBRUARY DETOXED FROM A METHADONE PROGRAM AFTER BEING ON IT ABOUT 9 YRS. I WENT TO AN ADDICTION DOCTOR. HE DEFINATELY DID THE RIGHT THING GETTING ME OFF THE METH. FIRST HE GAVE ME OXY-COTIN AND SOME KIND OF MORPHINE PATCH FOR ABOUT 3 WEEKS. THEN GAVE ME BUPRENORPHINE SHOTS THAT I HAD TO GIVE MYSELF FOR A COUPLE DAYS. NOW I AM ON SUBOXONE. STARTED WITH A 8MG TABLET A DAY. NOW I AM TAKING A HALF OF A 2MG TABLET( WHICH IS 1 MG.) I CAME THIS FAR FROM BEING ON METHADONE I REALLY WOULD LIKE TO KNOW IF I COULD DETOX OFF THIS 1 MG.
      THANKS, GINA

[wait2long]

you have posted to a very old thread...please repost your question and start your own thread, you will get more responses this way.

yes, he will do well on suboxone, it is an excellent tool in conjunction with therapy, yes he can and will feel normal with sub...
because he is young i would recommend a short term detox with sub....but if he relapses, get him right back on the sub and then maybe talk to the doctor about longer term maintenance, at this point he will become dependent on sub and have to taper off it, but compared to heroin, as you know, sub is safe.
right now it sounds like he is on 4 mgs?  2 mgs tabs?  what color are they?  if they are peach/orange in color, they are the 8 mg tabs with 2 mgs of naloxone...
if they are the 2 mgs tabs, they are white...

i am so sorry about your loss, that must be devastating for you....please remember suboxone is safer than heroin at any rate...if theres anything i can do please let me know...my thoughts are with you...
my sincere condolences to you and your family...
good luck and PM me anytime....
W2L

[Brooklyn57wfwf]

There is definately lots of confusion pertinent to Subs. Someone just posted that the 2mg tabs were white...let me clarify. I am a 10 year Marine with many deployments, last one being in Columbia under President Reagan (the war on drugs 1985 during the black ops operation stingray search and destroy Pablo Escobar). I was injured during an evac & extract operation in 1981. The Military put me on Mojo (morphine) pills. I took that and Bluebarries (oxys30,40 & finally 80's). To say the least, upon my discharge I was totally dependant on opiates!! The VA put me into a Methadone Maintenance Program...but I had requested total detox. They said that the long use of the prescribed pain medication had basically "rewired the natural order of my brain" thus best thing was the OTP. After 8 months I told VA that I WANTED TO GET OFF THAT "Jungle Juice". I was becoming impotent and was constantly nodding out (80mgs). Of coursecourse when they initally started me on 30mgs I was no longer dependant on the pain meds and had no wd's thus thought..."wow, this is a wonder drug!!" But now with the mentioned side effects I had enough. Subs and Vivitrol were then suggested. Problem was this: b4 I could switch over to one or the other I had to be COMPLETELY DETOXED FROM METHADONE. There had to be a period of 10 days of cold turkey after my last dose of METHADONE. If there was an iota of any morphine based substance in my body, Subs or tbe Vivitrol shot would send me into immediate withdraws. But if it was in reverse, Subs then opiates, NO WITHDRAWS. BUT OPIATE BASED ANYTHING THEN VIVITROL OR SUBOXOIN---a world of trouble would follow. Ten times worst than being dope sick!! Enters Subs...while a prior comment was made that a 2mg/.05 tab was white it is actually yellow with a 12 on one side and an A on the other (look it up on line). Perhaps what was mentioned in prior comment were "fugazee or off brand Subs". After going through the Stop Sign 8mg/2 x 3 (actually 30mgs a day and not the 24 mentioned) and being out of it, my dose was adjusted to 4mg/1.0 which equals out to being 2 of the small yellow Subs each being 2mg/0.5. After a few months, we reduced it to one small 2mg/0.5 tablet. Now I take 1/2 of a tablet. This is the problem...YEARS OF ABUSE OR PRESCRIBED MEDICATION DOES REWIRE THE RECEPTORS IN THE BRAIN. BUT I CANNOT IMAGINE TOO MUCH DAMAGE TO AN 18 YEAR OLD B/C the time of abuse matters. If the subject wants to sincerely get better (recover from the horrors of addiction) than he/she should take the absolute minimum amount of Subs or make a goal to start with what makes you feel normal (not high!!) and start tapering immediately. For a long term user and abuser, you may have to live with taking a very low dose day or every other day just to rejoin the 90% of what makes up the "Non-Problematic Productive Force" of Americans. If a little taste of Subs will allow you to become part of tbat force, then so be it. If you do any opioids over Subs (which will NOT send you into wd's)do not take another Sub for at least 30 hrs to avoid going into wd's. Finally, Subs have a huge street value. It is a Felony to sell your script. It comes with prison time and in tbe pokey, ITS COLD TURKEY!!

[rusty301]

I have a 18 year old son the started suboxone 3 weeks ago. I had a older son that died form Herion. Now my 18 year old just got busted for it. Should I be happy with suboxone and can he get to a normal life with it. How long does he have to take it, he is taking two pill a day not sure of the mg but is the smallest Dr. told me. Please answer I just about crazy with this.

[EXPFG]

I see it.  Some of us don't care how old an post is, it applies to what we are going through right now.  I have my first bupe appt on Monday and like to read all I can about it.  

[GMDaly1420]

I by no means wish to come across as negative or sarcastic, but if I need to come out to the "forum", for someone to see this, than how did you come across it?  Again, no sarcasm, I'm being honest, First of all what does it mean to come "out to the "forum."  Thanks.

[GMDaly1420]

I'm not understanding.  The last comment was posted on 7/19/07.  How was it started 4 years ago?  You'll have to excuse my computer savvy.  I haven't posted any comments until tonight.  It's sounds ridiculous but I only got this computer 2 weeks ago.  Thanks.

[IBKleen]

GMDaly...

This thread was started 4 years ago. You need to come out to the forum and start your own post. No one will see this one.

[GMDaly1420]

I've been told you can titrate down to quarters, however, I wouldn't do that without talking to your prescriber.  It's not just an aspirin.  Best of luck.

[GMDaly1420]

I meant to say in my previous comment, that methadone withdrawal was much longer and severe than the oxycontin withdrawal.  This is a common misconception, considering methadone is used for heroin withdrawal.  Sorry.

[GMDaly1420]

Thank you for your comments.  I didn't take methadone for very long, but I took it to come off oxycontin thinking it was a cureall.  I have to tell you, the withdrawal from methadone is nothing compared to oxycontin in regards to time and severity.  Thank you for your input.  I think your comment was the only one that made sense in regards to methadone withdrawal and Suboxone withdrawal.  Best of luck, but gratefully it looks like you won't need it.

[GMDaly1420]

I have to tell you, I have only been on Suboxone for 3 weeks, and I have to say the drug has been miraculous.  However, I am reserving decision considering Suboxone, even though it is much lesser of an opiate, it still is.  Before Suboxone I was taking 320mg. of oxycontin per day for over 2 years for pancreatitis, which was precipitated by drinking in my 20's.  The pain was excruciating, and any mild prescription, and especially anything over-the-counter wouldn't touch the pain.  I went to a gastroenterologist and he started me on 20mg. of oxycontin, and within 4 months I was taking 80 mg. tablets, 2 tablets 3 times per-day.  Eventually the pain wasn't as great but at that point it didn't matter.  I was already dependent on the drug, physically and psychologically.  I'm sorry to be so long-winded but I feel it necessary for you to understand the whole situation.  In any event, I tried to titrate myself off the oxycontin, to no avail.  Needless to say I recently went to a Dr. who could prescribe Suboxone, and I have so far found it wonderful.  No withdrawal accept nightsweats, which is a walk in the park compared to withdrawal when you go cold turkey.  I've read nothing but good things about the drug, but be prepared that when you do come off the Suboxone, you will go through some withdrawals.  Best of luck, and again I'm sorry I couldn't be more concise.

[GMDaly1420]

I think that your comments are completely ridiculous.  I believe you should look at yourself before you start making arbitrary comments about things you no nothing about.  Addiction is a very insidious thing.  It affects everyone differently because of the extreme psychological differences.  And aside from that, you are a conservative for Godsake.  Take a look at yourself, and mabye you should sign up for the armed forces and go to Iraq, to fight this farce of a war.  No, actually I don't mean that because I wouldn't wish that on anyone.

[soderbri]

I successfully switched from methadone to suboxone

If you are going to switch from methadone to suboxone, you MUST stop your methadone doses for 3 or so days before taking the suboxone. If you take suboxone while an opiate is in your system it will put you into serious withdrawals. Mehtadone has a huge halflife (at least 72 hours) so this is why you must wait 3 days.

I was on methadone for about a year at 80mg. I went from 80mg to 0mg and entered a 60 day inpatient rehab. This is where I learned that taking suboxone too early will throw you into withdrawal. The Dr. had to wait until I was in full blown withdrawal from the methadone before he satred me on suboxone. It was 3 and a half days of hell. Finaly I was givin 8mg of suboxone and most of my withdrawal symptoms were gone in 10 minutes. Over the next 4 days my dose was increased to 16mg of suboxone 2 times a day. And at that point I felt no withdrawal symptoms at all. I felt great all day long every day.

Over the next 2 1/2 months my dose was gradually lowered to 0mg. Dropping from 16 twice daily, to 12 twice daily, to 8 twice daily, to 8 once daily, to 4 once daily, and finaly to zero. I experieced some minor withdrawals after I went from 4 to zero. They wern't all that bad and they lasted about a week.

I would have to say that my detox went very smoothly. I was very dope sick for the first 4 days after stopping methadone but after my suboxone kicked I felt great. If anyone is planning on switching from methadone to suboxone, I would recommend getting your methadone dose down as low as possible. Around 30mg would be best.

Hope this helps someone.

[pastAndFuture]

2003? WTF? Hmmm, sure glad I wasted my time, then.

What about miss barbra? Is this a current post? Transitioning from methadone to sub/ bupe can be tricky. In order for bupe to work, you have to be feeling pretty bad, though you should instantly feel better. The other problem with bupe after meth is that bupe has a built-in "ceiling effect", meaning that taking more bupe will not have any effect. The ceiling effect is different for different people, figure > 24mg is pointless for 50% of the population, though 32mg gets given out all the time. Sadly for me it's about 8mg.(!robbed!), maybe 12. THis means that if your meth habit is "bigger" than 24mg of bupe, you will feel WDs. This is why your methadone dose must be tapered first. The times I did this, it was not really painful until about 20mg, but we are all different. I strongly dislike methadone, as I have nothing but bad memories associated with it. Nonetheless, it is possable, and desireable, to switch from one to the other. I have not done this myself, but have known a few who have. I wold think that finding a good addiction doc would be the way to go, the risks of improper medicating are very real.

The worst thing you can do is to take methadone and bupe at the same time. The bupe will "kick out" the meth and argue with it, leaving you mighty sick indeed. This is why you must wait for a while after taking methadone. I wouldn't want to attempt this without supervision from an *expirienced* MD near by. Someone who has done this before. So, get an MD, then get good nutritional health brain balancing, get a support group, or person, then you new found "people" will help you through it, knowing what to expect at every turn. This will reduce the fear by a huge amount.

Let us know what you plan on...

------------------p&F

[missbarbra6]

can someone help me. I am scared to take the suboxone because I am afraid I will go through withdrawels. I 'm on a really high dose of methadone and i really want to get off but I'm afraid if i take the sub i will feel so bad. what happens when you take it?

[mom2rachie]

Gina posted this question in 2003.  There is a glitch.  I'm sure she doesn't even come here and has since found help for her problem.

[pastAndFuture]

Hi,

You started this thread, and yet no one seems to have replied to you, save for FLaddict, who knows a lot about bupe.

Too bad the post went so poorly, not your fault, perhaps if you could post again, and hopefully the thrill-seekers will not use it for other means.

It is entirely possible to go from 1mg bupe to nothing, though you might consider taking .5 mg for a while. I have found that I have an easier time if I let my body adjust for 6 or 7 days at each dose level. Moving to nothing can then be somewhere between a cake walk and a horror show. I have done it before without too much fuss, though I did not get into recovery at the time, so never took advantage of being clean (and did not stay clean). I am now taking 1 mg per day, and getting used to it (day 4), though I'd be fibbing if I said I was feeling great. It is, however, a lot better than hardcore WD.

----p&F

[pastAndFuture]

------------------------------------------
Is suboxone hard to get off of?
------------------------------------------

Not nearly as hard as 150mg of methadone/day, or any methadone per day for that matter. That is a high dose, do you have a history of using other opiates?

Yes, a new thread would be a good idea, could you repost your question?

-----------p&F

[FLaddict]

You posted on a post in the archives from 2003... if you would please post a new question on the new page.. Not everyone has the set up to read old posts.. I know a good deal about Sub so I can help.. I used it for 10 days..
For one you would have to taper down to 20-30mgs of methodone a day to make the switch.. and be in WD for 48 hours to start the Sub..

[missbarbra6]

I have been on methadone for about 4 years and I am thinking about taking suboxone to get off of it. Is suboxone hard to get off of? Will I crave methadone's warm and fuzzy feeling ? that is why I hesitate to start the suboxone because i am so addicted to methadone. I do about 150 mg. a day of methadone .Will it make me sick to just start taking the sub? Will I feel bad or will I be okay and be glad i took it ? Do you immediately start feeling better or do you feel sick? I'm afraid to start taking it because I am afraid I will crave the methadone and than will not feel it  if I decide to start taking it again because the sub blocks the effects. I want to do the right thing . Does the sub really work ?Does the sub make you feel more in control and more alive not so dazed? please answer. thanx barbie

[bmac]

You are in the right place. Like I just posted sometimes addiction isn't pretty. Not all of us are in withdrawals and we tend to ***** alot and act like children. You will get alot of help here, you just gotta weed thru all the BS first!
Several people here are on or have been on SUBOXONE. So hang on til someone smart enters! Thanks and don't let this bickering mess with ya, It's waht happens when you get better.!LOL
             Bmac

[Ginaluv]

I ASKED A QUESTION ABOUT SUBOXONE. I AM IN THE RIGHT PLACE. I AN NEW  HERE. I AM VERY SERIOUS ABOUT THIS SITE. PLEASE TELL ME I AM IN THE RIGHT PLACE.   GINA

[bmac]

Nice name BTW, I have been here since last August. I came here for the same reasons we all do and I have been though many many arguments here and I have had discussions with Cindy about this kinda thing going on. First we are addicts and sometimes that ain't so pretty and sometimes we need to have these conversations. If you read one of my last posts to Goatbrain you would have read I meant nothing by them. I was only jabbing at him. It is stress releiving to me to have a good old word fight.

I ask in the future could you please address your complaints to us here and not to Cindy and Phil. They have enough to do without sending me and Goatman another email warning us about the fighting. They know us better than anyone. I am not talking down to you or trying to spar with you, I am just asking next time let US know about the problem and let's leave the Admins out of it! Thanks! Bill

[Kurt Cobain]

Well, "Med-Help forum police" notwithstanding, I have made my personal concerns in this issue clear via email to the administration here at MedHelp and am awaiting their reply.  Although I feel sorry for whomever is behind this needless and childish display (however many identities they may have), this should be a place for help, not distraction.  I encourage anyone else here who cares about the integrity of this forum to do likewise (I simply used the "***@****" email address and indicated in the subject line what the issue was).  Can you imagine if your first impression of this place was some of the junior-high school mentality bickering and name-calling we've seen in the last few days?  I know if it were me, I wouldn't be inclined to stick around. . .especially if I were already sick and desperate.  Losing potential family would be a true shame, especially since the majority of people here have such tremendous things to say and so much help, encouragement, and experience to share.

They say a word to the wise is sufficient. . .so perhaps on the behalf of all who are here to get better, I can simply ask that all the bullshit come to a halt, right now.  Of course, in the case of the unwise, a thousand words will fall on deaf ears -- that's where, hopefully, the MedHelp admins will come in if necessary.  Thanks, everyone, for hanging in there -- and to anyone newly visiting. . .give us a chance.  It really isn't like this all the time.

Peace,

Kurt

[bmac]

Addiction is a wonderful thing, don't cha think?
And BTW I don't know which one I would choose,Wilma or Betty or Maryann or Ginger but being myself and knowing me as well as I do, I'd prolly have them all and at the same time, so whats next?, so far I am batting 1000% !('nuff comas for ya now?),,,,,