Overcoming an illness you dont have, and the anxiety that it causes...

[Single_Man]

Ive learned that, you can develop symptoms that are caused by anxiety. Ive known that for a long time. What i didnt know is that those symptoms can actually manifest to be visible to another observer, particularly a symptom related to your anxiety driven illness. What bothers me though, is, "If a person develops a symptom that they did not know was related to that illness"? And my answer to myself is, "That symptom is caused by another symptom that is created by the patient."


I asked that of a person whom said this:

"A cautionary note about interest in the symptoms of HIV in the absence of significant risk:"

"...They report a wide array of symptoms, some of them are very severe. I think it is also significant that many of them appear to have been reading a lot about HIV since the incident which caused them to worry. Since these people are HIV negative, it seems logical to see a connection between their anxiety and their learning about HIV symptoms. Some of these correspondents report this connection after reflecting on it. For example, they develop diarrhea the day they read about that particular symptom."

I can imagine you know the perspective im coming from.

Thanks.

[txQC]

That's ok... I admit that I overreact and that I have a high tendency to feel offended... I have so many symptoms right now, some of them are linked to heart disease, even if I had heart tests done and saw 2 different Cardiologist in the last year. It's hard to believe that my tests results was negative, who mean that the symptoms I feel, the chest pain, the extreme tiredness and physical exhaustion, the weak blood pressure and slow pulse rate or too fast pulse rate is all linked to my anxiety. The second Cardiologist look again at my heart stress test with the ecography of my heart and he see that I have a mitral valve prolaspe, but I learn it only 1 week at my Family doc appointment, cause the cardiologist sent to him the medical report of the appointment I had with him last October! Since I learn that, my anxiety and heart worry increase a lot. Of course, I try to call the cardiologist to know what is the mitral valve prolaspe and to know why the first Cardiologist didn't see it when I had the stress test for my heart, but it's Christmas holidays, he will be back in his office only the 5th January! So for now I worry a lot for my heart...more than usual... I done a group therapy from September to the middle of November... I was able to be a passenger in a car and go on the highway without having the fast pulse rate and was able to get out of the house without feeling like I will die of a heart attack and without the intense jaw pain or headache or the strong chest pain... but at the end of November, while I was sit in the car with my mom on the middle of the highway, I had the worse panic attack I had in my entire life, my pulse rate was so fast and the pain in my chest so intense that I faint! Since then, I can't get out of my house... If I have an appointment and I have to go by car, someone else drive and we have to stop every 2 minutes because my heart race as hell, I need to get out of the car, take some fresh air, be back in the car, do another 1-2 km and stop again.... it can take 30 minutes to go to a place that usually take only 10 minutes by car... that's hard trust me!

If I mentioned what I lived and my symptoms in my first response, it was not to talk just about myself, i'm here to share what I live with the others and also to find some answers from my numerous symptoms...

I wanted to be nice with you and explain that anxiety can lead to real symptoms of a disease, that's it... My PDoc, who practice for more than 35 years as a Pdoc and who only have patients who suffer from anxiety disorders, say it's common to see very anxious peoples with symptoms who mimic a disease. He say that OCD  is probably related to that problem. For me, my obsession = heart disease, Compulsion = taking my pulse rate 100 times a day and my blood pressure 20-30 times a day... The results: fear of going out of the house because I know it will increase my pulse rate and triger panic attasck...  I will be to careful with my body sensations, I will need constant reassurance from the others especially from my Pdoc or my Family Doc... reassurance decrease the anxiety for a little while BUT the anxiety return with a revenge and new symptoms appears... that's a never ending circle... the more you are anxious, the more symptoms you will have and the more sure you will be to have a disease... To find an exit to that bad anxiety circle, you need meds + therapy... meds for severe case of anxiety and therapy cause everyone have to know the roots of their anxiety.... cause overall, the anxiety is like an alarm signal send to the body, a signal who say that something go wrong in your life... anyways...

My legs are turning red and blue because of poor circulation, I worked 10 years as a cook in a big restaurant, it was before I had my gastric by-pass, and it was a physical work... my legs hurt often because I have some varicose veins on them (on the lower parts of my legs), I can't afford to have treatment to remove those painful veins. Before I was hit by that severe panic disorder with OCD and agoraphobia, I had once in a while the pain in my legs but nevery pay attention to the pain.... but with the anxiety, I focus too much on my legs and see they are blue-red and I start making negatives scenarios in my head!!! The same thing happen with my hands... they are all the times clammy, red-blue with white spots on them... When I saw the Cardiologist last October, I show to him my hands and he look at them and say it was my anxiety who was doing that since no heart disease will give clammy hands or red veins... normally a heart disease like an arterial blockage will give white hands with no blood inside them, very cold hands... who is not my case... He also look at my veins in my to lower legs and say it's not dangerous... no blood clots, he just say to be careful and don't rub too hard my lower legs...BUT a part of myself refuse to believe him...and I can't control that part of my brain who refuse to say that's everything is alright, my legs pain or blue-red color is not related to a heart problem or another mortal disease... hard to explain... my english suck!!!

You know, I do my best to fight my anxiety, overcome my fears and stop worry about my symptoms, but I can't for now...even if my Therapist explain to me 1000000 times that anxiety can give a lot of real symptoms, it's like a part of my brain don't want to believe it.

I know that I will have to return on the Paxil soon but I fear meds now. I try almost 10 times to be back on the Paxil in the last year and never was able to take more than 1 mg a day without having 10 times worse anxiety symptoms... but i'm lucky, I have a new Therapist and she will help me to start the Paxil again and don't stop it even if I have increase anxiety, she will give to me some tips on how to cope with the side-effects...  

And no, I will never give up. I try many things to fight my anxiety, just this year, I spend a lot of money on alternative treatments (accupuncture, physiotherapy, yoga-relaxation...) with no positive result. And even if with the Therapy I don't see an improve, I continue to go each week to my appointment... cause I say to myself than maybe one day my brain will start believing that I have no disease and just anxiety and that my fears are unjustified.

Yes sometimes I just want to sit all day long and complains about my miserable life and be very negative,  but if I look all around the world,  i'm lucky, I have some money even if i'm on the disability right now, I have foods to eat, and first of all, I have a family to support me and peoples who love me.  I have no friend, cause they let me down when the agoraphobia hit me, and my social anxiety make it hard to make new friends... but I know that in a long term view, I will be able to make new friends, when I will feel better....

You know what bother me the more for now, it's the fact that I want to be useful for the society, I have goals to achieve in my life and i'm a lot frustrated cause right now I can't do anything, i'm stuck and paralize because of all the symptoms I have...that's the point... I was active all my life, and for me, not being able to get out of my house is something I can't accept...

Well, sorry for the long post again, I just wanted to make it more clearer... didn't wanted to be a pain in the a s s ...

[Single_Man]

Wow, reading all of that really showed me how foolish i was. I apologize greatly. That all sounds so rough.  Im not going to go through and explain myself, because it wont change the fact that it was wrong of me to be so rude and presumptuous. I am glad that you are doing your best to take care of yourself. I just didnt realize based on your first post, and i was just offering my advice. It makes me sad, because i know alot of people that know they arent healthy, and they dont do anything about it. So they slowly get worse and worse, and it gets to the point that you just have to give up trying to help them. Ive known alot of people like that and they just dont learn. Again, I am sorry.

[Single_Man]

I didnt read your entire response yet, but i was not trying to be rude. But your anxiety should encourage you to Do better things for yourself, such as changing your eating habits and physical fitness.

Im going to read your whole post now. Sorry for the frustration.

[txQC]

That's rude!!! I hate when peoples are ironic!!!! You say that what I wrote is not true??? Well, you can be sure I will never answer to one of your post!!!

You don't have to judge me because I smoke or eat  bread... Normally i'm an healthy man! Anxiety just screw up my food habits as well as my exercises habits (long walk, bike, roller blade), increase my craving for cigarettes smoking....You don't know how many times I try to quit smoking!?! Do you ever try to stop smoking, especially in a high state of anxiety? I don't think so!

By the way,  I don't eat HOT-DOG... I can't because of the gastric by-pass... and I don't eat maraconi and cheese, and don't digest the cheese!!!

And I don't sit in my *** all day long because I want to stay inactive and unhealthy!!! I stay sit cause exercises worse my anxiety and lead to more symptoms and more panic attacks!!! I subscribe to a gym last year and I start having panic attacks again because of this... that's when the cardiophobia start also... I don't say that exercises is not good, but for now I have to avoid it, cause I do severe panic attacks who lead to black out... also I avoid exercises cause my Cardiologist told me to be carefull, that's it!!!

For your information also, in the last 3 months, I try the hypoglicemic diet, I was eating more fruits, more vegetables, less bread and had 5-6 small meals... and I see no change in my anxiety... sugar seem to not trigger panic attacks on me or worse my symptoms... Anyway I had the blood work for the hypoglycemia and my result is ok, I don't have hypoglycemia...

The cardiophobia was diagnosticed by my PDoc recently and the Cardiologist also see that I had a big tendency to take often my pulse rate...  and YES, anxiety can create or  MIMIC real symptoms of real diseases!!! If you don't believe me, ask your PDOc, or maybe you don't see a PDoc or a Doc?!? Maybe you don't see a Therapist also... ?

And again, for your informations, I don't sit on my big *** all day long waiting that a miracle happen!!! I see a Therapist each week since 1 year... I work hard to feel better and manage more well my anxiety... but CBT don't work for everyone... and take a long time... especially when you have more than only one anxiety disorders to treat!!!

So stop being rude with the others...

You can't judge a book by it's cover!!!

I also have a Cardiologist that follow me, a regular Family Doc that I see every 3 months and a PDoc that I see each month!!!

I was on strict diet all my life because of the morbid obesity!!! As a kid I was fat... the only one in my family!!! I was going to private school and had to eat the same amount of foods than the other childs but I was not lucky and I gained weight more easily than the other kids... I was also very active as a kid, exercises every day, playing hockey, riding my bike iall sunny day in the summer, playing baseball...

Do you know what that's mean, BEING on a diet at 10 yo ? I don't think so... it's not natural to be on a diet at 10 yo...  No wonder why I have a high level of frustrations in my life.

I spend almost 6 years of my life on a liquid protein diet only, do you think it's normal??? No it's not...Of course, while I had morbib obesity, i've seen a lot of dieticians, I had to change my food habits before I got my gastric by-pass surgery... but I was gaining weight whatever all the attemps I was doing to control my weight!!!

I spend 26 years of my life, fighting to have a normal weight, I was doing intensive exercises while I was on strict diet... I remember that at one time, I was only eating 500 calories each day and was doing more than 50 km of bike a day and I gained weight...

I choose to have a gastric by-pass  10 years ago because I was tired of being on the diet all the time...and now my weight is ok... that's not mean that I eat junk food all day long cause I can't gain weight now!!! In fact, even with the gastric by-pass I can gain weight... I will have to be carefull all my life... since my level of anxiety is really high, now i'm losing weight, even if I eat sugar food like bread...

In a period of high stress and anxiety, some peoples will eat more and some of them will eat less, that's it! Me I need high carbs foods, it's the only thing who reduce my anxiety now... I crave for sugar that's it... it's temporary and I know that when my anxiety level will be stable or low, I will return to my normal food habits... for now i'm not very fit, but I will return in my normal healty life when the anxiety will decrease...

So stop being rude with the peoples who want to help you...

[Single_Man]

I dont mean to sound judgmental but, Get to a freaking doctor and work out your health situation. STOP smoking, Eat better, and go for a walk!!!  

Its good that you are aware of your situation, but you need to DO something about it now! I could never in my LIFE sit here and say "I dont eat very well" and then take another bite of a hot dog and macaroni and cheese.

Im not telling that you dont have anxiety, but if there IS something legitimately wrong with your heart, you have reasonable cause to be concerned. That is not anxiety, that is cause for concern.  

If your legs are turning blue and red, and you DONT have a condition that causes that symptom, THAT Is more like anxiety.  

Talk to your doctor man, change your diet, and stop the smoking. Dont say "i dont eat well" one more time, without having a plan to do something about it.  Not liking meat is a good start, but you just have to give yourself a wide variety of food. You literally can not survive on bread alone.

Wait this thread is about me LOL

When i was born, the doctors said i had a heart murmer, and since as long as i remember ive had chest pains at random times for seemingly no reason. I was suposed to "grow out of" the murmer. Some days ill just be sitting down doing nothing, and then Grab my chest and exhale deeply, as if having a heart attack. Its like a feeling of lightning going through me, its horrid. Sometimes it happens when im eat, and sometimes when im riding my bike. I dont really perseverate on it but it just happens. I had my first panic attack about 2 months ago, i was convinced that i was having an annyurism in my brain. Reason being is i thought i overdosed on a pain medication i had taken recently. I dont know the side effects of the drug, but i just knew that it was causing the pain in my head.

Wait a minute though, is your cardiophobia self diagnosed?

Because if what you say is for real, then that means that means that it IS possible to have physical symptoms be visible on your body caused by anxiety.

Thread is still open for discussion, as more information is always valued.  I dont even know if my statement above is true. Is it?

Thanks for your input man, and i really do hope that you can become a healthy individual. Its the most important thing in your LIFE!!

[txQC]

I live the same situation with my cardiophobia, I google everything on the heart, studies about increase risk of heart attack on peoples with a panic disorder, list of the symptoms of a heart failure or arterial blockage or all the symptoms related to a heart problems....and yes I have all of the symptoms for a serious and mortal cardiac disease and i'm still alive more than 1 year later...well, I don't call my actual situation a "LIFE", but I survive... I think the more you know about a disease, the more you read about the symptoms, the more anxious you will be and the more your anxiety will ensure that you'll think you've got the disease. I only have a MVP ( mitral valve prolaspe) problem with my heart, who is minor. I have it probably since i'm born and my anxiety just make the symptoms appear and I start to feel them since more than 1 year...

So I think you live the same situation in another way...

So you had an oral sexual contact with someone with the HIV? Or you don't know if that person actually have the HIV?

I had sex with some guys who have the HIV, I was aware of it, they was honnest with me and we take no risk and use all the protections needed... but I had oral sex with them, without any kind of protection, who can be dangerous,  but not for the HIV... you will be very not lucky if you caught the aids with only one oral sexual contact, you need to have a gum disease, a cut in your mouth or a wound... I heard a lot of funny things about not brush your teeth 2 hours before you have sex, things like that... but I don't think it's true... most of the people that I know, and I know a lot of them you are HIV + since several years, they have a normal life, they don't get sick more often then the peoples without the HIV, they just have to be carefull and have blood work done each 3 months to see the level of bacterial charge in their blood...

I think that with the oral sex, it can be A LOT MORE dangerous for other STD like the syphilis ( silent STD disease, no symptoms), chlamydia, gonorrhea, genital herpes....

I'm lucky cause I never caught a STD disease and I don't have the HIV... but I can understand you and the way you feel... Being all the time anxious cause we have symptoms of a disease that we fear, it's not very helpful to decrease the anxiety!!! Be strong buddy!!!

To return with the example of my heart... Each day I have strong chest pain, weak blood pressure, tachycardia or bradycardia, strong headache on the left side with eyes pain, pain on the left jugular vein, pain under my left arm pit, can't do physical task without being out of breath and feel tired for 2-3 days in a row... Of course, i'm overfocused on my symptoms and if I goggle them ( I try to not google my symptoms anymore, I just use that website), I will find that I have certainly a heart disease who will lead to a cardiac arrest, a coronary artery blockage probably will give the same symptoms!!! Of course I freak out each day and it's increasing my anxiety... and the more anxious I am in face of my symptoms and the more convinced I will be that I have a real heart disease, and the more tired I will feel, and the more symptoms I will have...it's a never ending circle.  The more you will watch and be attentive to your symptoms, the more anxious you will be...

I know, it's easy to write but it's not easy to do... I can't do it myself!!!


Right now, I write to you and my legs are turning blue-red, same things for my hands... and i'm stuck with the idea that I have some blood clots in my legs and in my arms and that I will have a stroke or a cardiac arrest... I know it's only my anxiety who give me those symptoms BUT I control my thoughs and i'm sure it's my heart...

I also know that I have all the bad habits to have a heart disease. I smoke 1 pack of cigarettes a day ( each morning I wake up and say that I will stop tomorrow... but with that anxoety level I can't stop, I try often but each time I do more panic attacks...), I don't exercise (fear of a heart disease and fear of triggering a panic attack), I had morbid obesity for 26 years of my life BUT I had a gastric by-pass 10 years ago and my weight is ok now, I'm not in shape, I don't eat well (too much bread and sugar, don't eat enough protein since I hate meat, I don't eat a lot of fruits and vegetables)... I know that it's not good for me and it's increasing my fear of a heart disease and I blame myself each time I eat something not good for me or when I light up a cigarette... and blame myself each time increase my anxiety level...

Well, I write too much again... sorry!!!

Take care of you ok !!!

[Single_Man]

The thing is though, i actually had oral sexual contact, and i was in the HIV community being told that "Oral sex has no risk of transmiting HIV". I still couldnt get past the idea. i Mean the purple spots under my lips and on my gums, they really creep me out. Did you get dark spots too? i mean, im feeling much better, and im almost convinced that i dont have HIV, but i seem to be perseverating on the "purple spots" so much that they still linger.. which makes me wonder if IM the one that is making them stay there, due to my anxiety.  Was there a legitimate reason that you thought you were infected with HIV?

[sgately11]

I know this first hand. I convinced myself I had HIV when I was 22. Here is what I fealt, 3 months of extreme fatigue, white spots on tongue, swollen glands, low grade headache and fever. Outcome 3 HIV tests all negative.

Once the anxiety "broke" all of the symptoms disappeared completely overnight, which was odd because the day before I could barely walk up the stairs slept for 12 hours a day , didn't eat and was nauseous . I also got unrelated symptoms that developed on their own. The problems with symptoms is that most illnesses share them and you can read much to much into them.

I am not sure why I landed on HIV, it was odd, but I guess my brain was burnt out from cancer and brain tumors, encephalitis etc.

So yes I think we can and do develop unknown related symptoms. And you would be surprised at what you actually know and have read versus can remember.

[Single_Man]

# profound and unexplained fatigue
# swollen lymph glands in the armpits, groin, or neck
#red, brown, pink, or *purplish* blotches on or under the skin or inside the *mouth*, nose, or eyelids
#white spots or "unusual blemishes" on the tongue, in the *mouth*, or in the throat

These are the symptoms that i have experienced, though i didnt know about the "purplish blemishes" in the mouth, yet i have experienced it before i read about it.

Is it possible that this symptom was in fact caused by another symptom?