do truly gay people ever doubt to themselves that they are gay?

[ihatethiscrap]

im talkin about when they first realize it.. do they ever think "crap what if im gay?" or "i might be gay?" or do they just know it all along.

i think ive been suffering from hocd. ive posted on here a couple times now (people who have replied to my other posts are going to probly get frustrated when they see this one). but ive been told that if i truly was gay i would know. but i dont know.. i THINK. i MIGHT be.. ive had heterosexual experiences. and i thought i liked them. but what if i thought i like that just cus i didnt know i was truly gay and would enjoy a gay experience more?. when i first looked at gay porn it freaked and grossed me out. but i tried it recently and it wasnt as bad as it was.. still id like to think that it was kind of disturbing. but my thoughts are so distorted i think right now that idk what i find disturbing and what i dont.. i dont want to be gay.. but its startin to feel inevitable.

now when i get gay thoughts i think maybe its not so much hocd as repressed feelings that im ashamed of? i know these sound like the typical hocd questions but i just cant put down in writing what im truly going thru it feels like..

new people reading this read my other posts too if you like and tell me what you think. id appreciate it..

and ps. im guna see a counselor as soon as i get to school.. i just want a few more questions answered..

[naturalone69]

look i am a christian myself and do not believe that you hate gays. it would be not different being scared that you might be bipolar but does not mean you hate bi-polar people. You might now want to be as in being gay, but i am sure you are not a hater. i dont like the community for the most part but that does not mean i am against gays. its the attitudes of some and the messing around on partners and abuse that goes on.

One gay was right when he said be who you are but dont let others define that for you and even him. gays sometimes are only concerned about having another person to justify their sexuality. it doe snot mean it is always the case, so in conclusion i do not believe you are against gays WHAT SO EVER!!!!

[naturalone69]

ok i know know the acronym. I knew about identity problems bud but that doesnot mean i know the acronym. i thought you would be intelegent enough to know not everyone is not familiar with acronyms, that would be like saying you should know whether or not you are gay, bi, or straight because you should know your own body, thoughts and feelings. come on  bud!!!

[Julie359]

Ps.. Sorry for typing errors, writing from phone, very small keys!

also u stated u do have a counsellor, which is fantastic, will you be starting the sessions soon? Is it a school counsellor? Personally I think the sooner u get to see this person the better as it seems to be taking up far too much of your energy and thoughts and is making u sick.  Can you not get to see this counsellor sooner rather than later?

[Julie359]

You know now that I've read ur response I would say that this has everything to do with what your brother done to you as a child,  and witnessing the 'gay' stuff that he was doing.  it is clear you have been traumatised by this and with the passing of your father yoiur feeling lost.  

You knoiw your not gay, you got very defensive and sounded angry in your last comment, which I am sorry for, but doiesnt this tell you? Your extremely confused because youir shouting out that u knoiw 100% that your not gay and yet your still getting anxiety that you might be... To me this makes no sense whatso ever, only apart from the fact that your still having issues facing past memories.

You need to attend counselling to chat about this expereinces with your brother and the you can start to move on.  From what you say and the way u say it ur far from gay, what u need is help!

[ihatethiscrap]

and i am a christian, but im not so religious that id think im going to hell or whatever if i were gay or anything..

and those of you who know about hocd, the reason im thinking so surely it is is cus ive been getting "better" from it or whatever. like ever since ive been back at school i havnt really had the thoughts or they havnt been as strong. i havent been attracted to any guys or anything and i notice a  girl instinctively and am attracted to girls. its only when i start thinking about it like when i chill out at the end of the day that the doubting comes back.

after reading some of the replies on this today i spiked pretty bad and today was hell

[ihatethiscrap]

i have grown up thinking that i am straight. not because i was told to be, but because i truely thought i was cus i liked girls. and i can remember back to my early childhood my brother always did gay stuff and i tthought he was weird and i always felt different from him. i always had guy friends and we never did gay stuff. or even had the thought to.. it wasnt till my father passed away when i was 12 that i started to feel anxious and stuff all the time. i think just not having anyone to talk to about "stuff" going through puberty and stuff that is causing this now.. i really dont think im suppressing my gay feelings, because they arent truely there. im just scared of becoming gay or the possibility that i MIGHT be gay and just not know it because most of my sexual experiences with women have been a fail. i still get emotionally attatched to them and fiind them sexually attractive. yea it ***** leaving my friends at home when going off to college but thats just natural.

and if i was gay i wouldnt be scared of coming out because im scared of what others might think of me but because i myself dont think i could accept it.. i see gay people and i just say thats not for me. if anything i think id be asexual. ive never fantasized about guys before.

oh and this all started while i was over at a girls house and we were watching some stupid show on tv and it was showing how this one dude had a gay experience with a friend once and that friend was trying to get him to accept it and he didnt want to and then he tried to hook up with a girl and had problems "performing" and thats when it all started.. cus ive had problems like that just about everytime im with a girl..

but im thinking that problem is something else rather than me being gay. cus ive had dreams about girls a couple nights ago and liked them..

and no i havnt seen the counselor.. i havnt had time yet

[Julie359]

Have you been brought up to believe that being gay is wrong? Either by family members or friends around you or both? Parents can play a massive part in giving a child the confidence to be who they truely are and if your parents are very anti-gay or the people around you are then of course your going to try to repress your natural feelings.

The reason I feel you have grown up in this type of environment is the fact that you so clearly think that being gay, as you quoted, is disgusting, gross. Are you a religious person?  Where you live or close by are there any gay bars or cafes you can go to, maybe try to make a couple of friends with guys and girls who are gay, see how you feel in that environment.  Go onto gay chat web-sites maybe and chat to other gay guys, see how you honestly feel.

The one thing I would say is yoiu shouldn't deny who you are out of fear of what others may think of you, you are a unique and special individual who was born to be who you are... Listen to lady gaga's song, born this way.. She is right, you need to be truthful to yourself, cause you need to know there is nothing wrong with being gay.  I can openly say I've had two lesbian experiences in my time, and yes I would consider myself bisexual. One teenage daughter has declared ahe is fully lesbian and the other daughter bi-sexual.. And I'm fully suportive of them.  I'm actually extremely proud of them for being themselves and not trying to fit in with how society thinks we all should be.

Let me quote you a saying.... Why do we keep trying to fit in when we are born to stand out!!  

Experiement, go places where gay guys are and chat, have fun.. Stop seeing this as something to be ashamed of... There is nothing shameful in accepting who you are!  

[pottsem]

what a great way to respond (your first post about encouraging counseling) my roomies are gay and ever so often when they get drunk and sleep with men they question their sexuality the next morning, but then go back 24 hours later to not caring about the lingering doubt- what do you think about this- how should I respond?

[nursegirl6572]

ihatethiscrap...

Many people wouldn't know what HOCD is.  It is actually not a recognized diagnosis, just nore of an adopted term to explain the overwhelming fear of being homosexual.  Just wanted to clairfy that for you...it isn't common knowledge for most people.

[DefectorQC]

Hummm, i'm gay and as a kid I was already aware that I was more attracted to guys than girls BUT some of my gay friends discover it more later in their life, I think it's different for everyone. My best friend, who is gay, had many girlfriend between 18yo and  20 yo, and he discover later that he was gay, he explain to me that he was already aware about the fact that he was attracted to men before, but wasn't really ready to live his gay life... Also, for me being gay don't mean to be different, live in the gay village, and do things like that... I live a normal life, have straight, bisexual, and gay friends, my life is normal and my  anxiety disorders are not linked to that. I don't feel reject when peoples told me they don't like gay peoples or understand how it's possible to know as a kid that someone is gay...  and I agree that it can be very difficult for some peoples to be who they are really cause they are afraid to told their families and friends that they are gay... or bisexual... For me it was the main problem... And no, I never had sex with girls cause they don't attract me, so it's possible to be gay at 100% even if you don't experience sex with a girl... That's an important point here cause a lot of peoples say that it's impossible to know that you are gay if you don't have sex with the opposite sex...

[JGF25]

Please tell me you saw the counselor, or are they not back in school yet?

[ihatethiscrap]

and i know it doesnt matter what you think n all that n what not but look up HOCD and then let me in on ur opinion. ive read some things on here that scream hocd but you can never really be sure. idk man.. from reading your stories i feel like im different than what you have been through. like i am straight. my brother fits more your story if anything. but then again i also feel different from some of my straight friends because im not always on the "***** prowl"  

and just wondering, if you dont know what hocd is what are you doing on this forum thing? i dont mean this offensively at all, by any means, im just wondering.. its just one of those questions that popped into my head.

[ihatethiscrap]

thanks for replyin man i have good friends, some of the best friends, but again i never get turned on by them. even in the locker room n stuff. but the more i think of it the more the thoughts come back...
oh and just google HOCD.
but yea i hope i have that horrible disease. my dad has been deceased since i was 12. and ive envyed some guys for what they have, but never had any sexual thoughts towards them, i dont think.. but yea. im just strugglin right now. i think so much about it that im startin to think im asexual.. (neither attracted to guys or girls)

have u ever watched straight/lesbian porn and got turned on?

im pretty sure this is all just a mess in my head, much like when i thought i was schizophrenic.. but man.. its killer

respond asap. please.

[naturalone69]

My dear friend, let me start by saying, what i think you are does not matter I t should not matter to ANYONE!!! What should matter is you sound like a warm and caring guy!!Your sexuality is for you to explore and NO ONE to exp[loit it or mess with you. It sound like there are some others on here who feel the same. I can be a friend and tell you how i feel and my experinces but your is your own and nobody elses. DO NOT get mine confused with yours. Your unique with different emotions, feelings, and experiences.

As far as if I find women attractive, yes I do but not in a sexual way. I have thought about trying it, but never did. I am kinda scared, but I am what is referred to as a bottom. I am sure you can figure that out. I do not able to sustain a top level and not sure even with a woman whether thats just nerves and insecurity or not i am not sure. I possibly one day. I suspect nits nerves since I feel every so often I could try on my own or with a guy or feel as if i could with another guy.

As far as hoc, i am not sure what that is, could you explain?

As far as denial to myself!! If there was any it was slight. I would say more scared than anything. I remember was I was roughly 7 or 8 and there was a guy who had a camper on the property between out two buildings and I wanted to lie down with him and felt a sense of feeling and warmth towards him. My problem may have stemmed from not having a father and not knowing what was a normal feeling and not. some guys will look at another guy in the face and just watch them as if to study. I felt if I did that someone would be bothered or mad. I grew up with many friedns cause I was abused by one very badly contnually and a teacher of very old school so I became a loner and was easier that way. I  never had that warmth with a man except occasionally from my grandpa and such a desire to be excepted and have some warmth. I told my mom was I was 13 i had an experience and she was shocked and said "You like that sort of thing". her brother was gay so i guess she could not take her son being that way. she wanted to be a grandmother so badly and due to her bad health and being scared told me repeatedly as a child how she could live with me and my wife when i get married and look after the children> i care about her but being a child it was kinda hard to me it was personal and I was not ready for that sort of thing and it made it hard as some other things occured as well. Later on mom would also refer to my grandma referencing my at work and her at home adn being Like a husband and wife, where the husband goes to work and the n wife stays home. The husband should be able to come home and not do much since he has put in a busy day. I repeated there is such a diff and grandma was horrified. I feel  that she has some mental health issues and this made me uncomfortable along with a teacher being very abussive in school. It terrified me, So i would say mainly scared, but some denial  but being found out and yet wanting liberation, freedom from feelings or comfortable with my feelings.

Well my friend youn said you dont get turned on at all, that in itself should help you with some feelings. I can me an affectionate guy. I remember as a child being abused and thinking maybe i should turn towards girls and wont get hurt so much but truth be known it did not matter so much. One girl would stick her nails deep into my arm or scrap my arm. a few were kinda arbasive a bit or not friendly and that hurt so I went back to guys and I guess having a very abusive uncle and abuse in the family as a whole I feel subconsciously it was to be accepted. i kept going back to a guy who through rocks at my head, beat me up and spat on me. . For years into adulthood I would shake and break down if a woman raised her voice. or anyone was abusive. even sexually with a guy I would feel much more satisfied just lying together and falling asleep cuddling. why theres nothing other that pure care and warmth. sex, anyone can bang someone, but I sometime so want some affection even if it was a guy just hugging me and saying they care. and a feeling as if im ok just where i am and they accept me that way., but allowing me to build up to the person i want ot become.

anyways, i rambled on and got sidetracked. Look bud ther are reasons for feelings and needs. you are a normal guy!! be true to yourself and be patient. People have a better time to some degree than when I was a child sincethings are to some degree more acceptable, but still difficult. just find the right people who care and love you for who you are and you know what you might be straight and your a cool guy just for being you!!!!! DO NOT let anyone try to decide for you and keep true. my things was talking about it and having friends close enough. i pray that you ahve warmth in your friends bud and you know your loved.

Take care and always willing to chat!!!


Aaron

[ihatethiscrap]

thanks for that response.. you were very clear in your responses and experiences. my gay brother made me do some things when i was little and i do remember i felt uncomfortable about it, but thats the only gay experience i had. after reading what you said im almost positive im straight.. im back up at school now and i noticed some hot girls without even thinkng about it. in fact my "hocd" was hardly even there. i was still a whimp in hitting on them tho... i have a few more questions.. do you think hocd is a real condition? or just a form of denial? and do you find girls attractive at all? other than just being curious... i think that my hocd stems from me just being curious, because of past "problems" while hooking up with girls.. i still find them attractive, but now followed by that feeling is a feeling of guilt and depression cus i think whats the point if i might be gay? and then i just feel bad for a while after that... ive considered  myself straight up until this. of course ive always wondered if others thought i was gay n whatnot but i think thats just normal.

and when i ask if you were ever in denial i mean were u ever in denial to yourself? like you just absolutely did not want to accept it? and after thinking back, i used to check out guys as an early teenager, but im pretty sure the feelings were just envy and not sexual arousal. i dont get turned on at all by other gay people.. but its like i have 2 people up in my head saying two opposite things..

what do you honestly think i am?

[naturalone69]

I wasnt quite sure. At a young age i knew i liked guys bodies and wanted to explore. Now was that cause of soemthing that happened as an infant and 4 yrs old, i do not know. I had a father who was very abusive and would have sex with other women in front of mom. I wonder based on my visualiizaton at 4 if i wasnt abused in some form at least viisually. I recently went to saskatoon at the begining of this year. I met some nice guys and really like chatting,. At the end there were a few, straight mind you, who  said goodbye and gave a hugg. a few yrs ago i would not have wanted it since i was assulted and abused and was in no mind set for even being touched. However, it felt good. I acctually felt someone liked me for who i was as a person. they did not knwo i was gay. maybe suspected, i do not know. but since i have always been scared of someone knowing and abuse in my life, i became a loner all the way from grade school until a few yrs ago. i only really started to talk to people about 10 yrs ago. now what do i mena. i would talk before but i mean other than something what was needed, such as work related or other things. i felt what i had to say did not matter to people and a teacher who use to scream and stab pencils in us and crack rulers across desks scared the living hell out of me. So in answer to your question did i deny or have any doubts. I guess i did. realize one thing my friend. it was not accepted when i was a kid. in calgary alberta it was only in the 1990's when a person could not be kicked out of their apartment any loonger for being gay. things have changed so so so much in such a short time. i still dont tell everyone . its from my socialization people know and not from me really saying. i have a few old school friends who are on facebook and i would love to tell some, but to be honest i am a little afraid, why, cause i am starting to adjust from being a loner and maybe im afraid at this point of possibly lossing what i have. i think they suspect but they wont ask or push. i just have to gradually feel them out. remember one thing we all came from the same generation. things have changed but there can be still some mindsets. Even equality has changed so much since i was a child. you are lucky my friend in ways to be born into this generation. I am also a christian and believe in christianity. that also plays a factor. its not as easy as one sees it. my uncle was gay and everyone knew it. he was not shy, but unfortunately he was gay during the wrong period and he died. my  first real experience was at 13 with a so called friend. i felt embarrased and told my mm. her response, was "you actually liked it' that scared me alot. i came out to her as an adult and then went back in several times hoping to let her know but got scared. i hoped that maybe she might climatize,lol. so in answer to your question yes i denied it, and as far as doubts, i would say i never outright made a decision so that helped as well. i would say i not quite doubted but was curios about females. but more attracted to males. i guess going back for abit. when i came home from saskatoon, for the first time i did find myself feeling as if i possibly could be with a female. that was ion part cause i felt i could be myself with guys and feel that sense of warmth so i in turn was able to feel somewhat validated. i did get back into my old habits though. i have been going through a lot of counsellling since i suffer from anxiety and depression from all the abuse and my sexuality. I have never had a sexual encounter with a woman, and yes i would love to try it. i am scared since i am not sure if she may discover , or i will not be good in bed. i have always ben worried i may not be the kind of man i  should be.

so my friend i am still discovering. I have to be open as i am to the facts that there are different variables in my life. thats why i say be true to yourself and let no one decide for you. this is the time my friend you WILL discover who truly loves you and is your friend. your frineds male or female will love you for who you are and NOT for what they feel they can get out of the realtionship. remember one thing!! if you belive in god. he loves you for exactly who you are. and no matter what confusion one has, stress they have, or problem in their life. there is NOT one person better than another on this earth. also please i really do mean this. If you EVER decide to try out a gay experience. dont EVER believe if they say they are safe. there are ones that are, but its not worth your health. i always wear a condom and even still i make sure they pull before they complete. i dont even trust fully in oral. there is not any exchange. i have been tested and am absolutely safe. i say this in part cause if your new and not sure of things you dont want to meet the wrong person. now having said that it can be so in the straight community too. all i am saying is be cautious, especially since you may very well be straight. you dont want to ruin you chances of a beautiful and meaningful relationship with a woman. if someone does not understand they are not worth the effort. you can always ask me questions since i am a gay male.you will go through ups and downs, POSSIBLY!!!! look i am here as a friend. If you want i am here to listen as with others. i hope this helps a bit. i hope to chat again and maybe even chat on other things as well if you wish. Take Good Care!!!!

[naturalone69]

Thanks!! I like to think I care alot. Unfortunately it can mean i get abused from caring as well. I just now what its like and dont like what i see often in the gay community. I see myself no different than a heterosexual. The truth be known though its really no better in the hetero life as there is so much break up and divorce. Its sociaty that needs a change. I think as my counsellor says be kind and comapssionate to ones self and others. We rush in too quickly. Its the way the coomunity is. Everything is on the rush and your pretty much old is your over 25-30. i mean come on!!! The day we look at each other and take the time to develop a friendship and get to knwo the other person and then maybe date is the day I think a lot of problems will ease. However the way its geared and because one is considered old after a young age, it does not lend much for these adaptations. We have to change the way we look at things,. You know I was in my early 30's and one guys in his 50's wanted to have sex with me. I was not interested. He nicely persisted and i nicely rejected and this went on for awhile. I got to know him and liked what i saw. I ended up having sex with him and you know what! We saw each other everytime he came back to the city. Why? I go to klnow him and all of a sudden It want just looks but his persoanlity that shawn, and even better he was a very warm person and gentle. unfortunately any one I have been with and really liked was bi. My darn luck!! the point is we need to look at things differently and when we do I think we will be happier and I think we will gain wider acceptance by the straight community. it might now be easy on gays and lesbians and bi's by far, but there are some who are descent and truly care. one just has to look!!  To be very honest its not all about sex withme, its about having a peson in my life who is warma nd caring. i have been with guys who there was no sex just cuddling and falling asleep and to be honest that meant more to me than any sex could ever mean. reason!! because its real. we are humans and not animals and thats where the real test comes in, when we see each other are humans and not just sexual. Do i get happy seeing an attractive guy, yes! but theres far more than just the sex.

[ihatethiscrap]

im startin to think im gettin over the hocd stuff and i think im startin to realize it was just a phase cus the anxiety and stuff is going away. but i have some questions.. when did you first realize you were gay? and at first did you want to deny it or have any doubts at all? have you ever had any heterosexual experiences? and do u get turned on by women at all?

[BluCrystal]

WOW!!!  I wish my keyboard had an 'applause' button!  I am a bi female, and this is the very first time I have heard a gay man speak so frankly and eloquently about his sexuality.  I learned a lot reading your post, and thank you for sharing it!!! - Blu

[naturalone69]

just want to follow this thread

[naturalone69]

Just be yourself buddy. Don"t ever let anyone decide for you if your gay or straight. That is for you to decide. I am a gay male and I had an experience at 4 yrs of age and when alittle older looked at guys and fantasised about them. I often wonder based on seeing an object and visualizing it as a males part I was abused as at a very young age. For me its hard to say where those feelings and /or thoughts came from but what i do know is i like guys. Now dont freek out guys cause the truth be told. just bacause someone is gay does not mean we are going to attack you, lol. What bothers me is one cannot do anything another does not want. So why is there homophobia and why do straight men watch porn with men and women. You are watching another man!!!!! Now why? Why watch another man? That makes you bi at least!! I am being a devils advocate her and my point being is its all situational. You now I flirt on the straight lines and you now the number of men that you do it with a nother guy if there was a woman involved. Its all the way we look at things. I dont knwo how old u are, but teens go through this natural cycle. We now live in an age where previously woman were cool if they were bi and well now guys are comming along and quite honestly i have had a few guys say no im stright but thanks for finding me interesting!!! That totally blows me away. Guys that are sure of themselves but appreciate the diversity and people being themselves. Remember one thing you are probably just wondering what its like from the other pespective. You saw a gay porn and we all have what is refered as mirroring which means when we see womething sexual we feel what the other person is feeling therefore it becomes real You my friend are no different. I personally beacause of anxiety and depression due to abuse and being gay was a loner and have friends but none close. I go to a bar and met one guy a couple weeks ago and we chatted and enjoyed talking. I asked may i and went to slowly give him a hug which he hugged too. i went to pull away after a moment of hugging and he kept the embrace and so i did for a moment longer. ther was absolutely nothing sexual and i could tell. he probably liked the affection and nneding some care as i did at that time. it was genuine.Guys are seen as these maucho guys andwell whats wrong with caring about others and you know what i did not have any feelings toward this guy other than he is a nice and warm person. and felt like he cared at that moment about me as a person. does this make one gay, no!! so lets be careful by pigeon holing people into areas that no one has a right to judge. be with real caring people who are not in it for there own selves bud. be yourself, but a word of caution, ther are gays who will exploit this and tell you that you are or try to get you into bed. no different than heteros. dont let anyone judge you. if a person cares they will talk with you and listen and allow you to speak and critique yourself, but dont let thoughts be entertained in your head and careful whom you speak with. a counsellor is a good start only to examine thoughts and patterns  just make sure he or she is a good therapist who is neither for or against gays. they are there for your interst. i have a therapist who supports gays, but in no way trys to say im ill because of it nor say im definately gay.  anyways bud, take care and i hope to chat with you and learn how things are going. be yourself and remember there are people who care!!

[RubyWitch]

I'm sorry to say that I haven't read your other posts, so I may be missing some salient points. I just wanted to tell you that my 26 year old son is gay and he has told me he knew when he was quite young and never had any doubts about his sexual orientation. My gay friends, male and female, have told me they always knew they were "different," but some didn't figure out in what way until they were teen-agers. I think that's pretty normal as most of us don't think about our sexuality until we hit puberty.
Seeing a counselor will be good and was a very wise decision on your part.
May I give you one piece of advice? Actually, I guess it's more my opinion than advice, some will disagree with me, but I believe this to be the absolute truth. Being gay is NOT a choice.
As others here have told you, when the confusion passes, whoever you are, be proud.
Peace
Greenlydia

[JGF25]

if you put the mouse pointer on my name in the above post, there is a "send a message" and you can just leave a message there.  But it will only be me if you do that.  If you keep posting here on the forum, you will get a lot of advice from different people,

I really liked what ThatGuy1989 had to say.  

[ihatethiscrap]

JGF25, which post are you talkin about? ive just recently responded to a few hocd posts on stuckinadoorway.org.. i would rather talk to another hocd person on here and ask all my questions to them then go see a counselor. at least to start.. cus as of right now i cant tell whats real and whats hocd. its like its neutral..i wish it is hocd tho. i pray it is. i used to love the female body before this.. now its like "or did i really? or did i psyche myself out.." and that question is gettin stronger and stronger.. maybe i liked it because it was different?

jgf25 do u have a message board i can reach you by? u seem to respond to my posts the most and i would like to keep talking to you. i really think its hocd some days.. but other days im in horrible doubt. if you do have an instant message think, if thats even possible on this website, please let me know. idk if i need to hear from a professional rather than someone who went thru this. i feel like a therapist would try and take a different route than ocd you know? i want it to be hocd.. but i want it to stop too