Psycho-neuro-cardiology

[Jogeshwar]

Are here specialists/experts  in this area.If so, is their experience rewarding?

[erijon]

I do agree with Ed's thinking. I just don't buy into holistic or alternative medicine. Everything is the result of a chemical reaction, it's all about how those chemical reactions are managed. You can't change physics by willing a different outcome.

Just my opinion, everyone is entitled to theirs, this is mine.

Jon

[Jogeshwar]

As far as I understand the critique is directed against the thinking of medical fraternity as reflected in its previous message.However,none,not even enjon, has endorsed the analogies. So it is back again to individual understanding and knowledge as against collective wisdom.

[ed34]

When I say heart, I mean cardiac health.
What you are reading into is just the first stage of the journey. You are blaming the mind for the outcomes, but the mind isn't the cause. If you take any great ape and put it under immense stress, believe me, it will either have a mental breakdown or die. Do we blame the apes brain for this? Do we say the mind was the cause?  Of course not. Continue your journey up the ladder and see if you can reach the real cause.
It's a bit like saying a man invented an axe for chopping down trees. You try to use it for breaking concrete, but the axe shatters. You then blame the axe.

[Jogeshwar]

April 17, 2012
If You Are A Positive Person, You Are Protecting Your Cardiovascular Health

Over the last few decades numerous studies have shown negative states, such as depression, anger, anxiety, and hostility, to be detrimental to cardiovascular health. Less is known about how positive psychological characteristics are related to heart health. In the first and largest systematic review on this topic to date, Harvard School of Public Health (HSPH) researchers found that positive psychological well-being appears to reduce the risk of heart attacks, strokes and other cardiovascular events.
http://preventdisease.com/news/12/041812_If-You-Are-A-Positive-Person-you-Are-Protecting-Your-Cardiovascular-Health.shtml?utm_source=041812&utm_campaign=041812&utm_medium=email

[ed34]

I think Jon is absolutely correct, there is no link between the mind and the heart. The brain simply interprets, and through interpretations (right or wrong) it can make us feel very different. A classic example is stem cell therapy on the heart. Scans show it makes no difference, yet some patients are free from shortness of breath and walking huge distances. This has to be that the mind has convinced itself due to incorrect decisions on interpretations. The human brain is basically a box with millions of signals coming in to be interpreted. If we train our minds that the pain signals should be ignored or less intense, we can endure far more pain. This doesn't mean the body isn't being damaged.

[Jogeshwar]

It is not only the religion which capitalizes on beliefs or faith. There are many others too.

"I don't believe there is a connection between the mind and cardiac health".

[ed34]

Correction*  is science = in science

[ed34]

"Science/nature is independent of any body's belief"

What about that huge religion is science, I think they call it evolution.

[Jogeshwar]

"I don't believe there is a connection between the mind and cardiac health."

This is one more very thing I wanted to unveil. Science/nature is independent of any body's belief but medical practice is not so.

[erijon]

I don't believe there is a connection between the mind and cardiac health. The heart is more of an involuntary mechanical process and it's overall heath is the result of the structural integrity of the organ itself along with the health of the arteries. I don't think one can "will" their heart or cardiovascular system to be healthy.

Having said that, I do feel there may be a case for psycho- neuro-immunology as I can image that one's state of mind may affect the immune system. It has long been understood that depression can lead to a suppressed immune system so the opposite should also be true. As we know, a suppressed immune system can lead to the inability of the body to fight off infection and disease.

Again, just my 2 cents worth.

Jon

[Jogeshwar]

But where is psycho-neuro-cardiology?

[Jogeshwar]

"Yes, I think I can question his knowledge and wisdom."

This is what I wanted to unveil. Almost every individual understanding and knowledge is subjected to this state of affair.

[ed34]

Just to add, I recommend to anyone here that they follow their Doctors advice. They are kept up to date with latest research and offer you the best solutions. If you require medication, then it's because you need that medication to extend your life. High blood pressure causes many fatal problems long term yet so many people think blood pressure medication is a waste of time because they read certain web sites. I recommend people take their meds.

[ed34]

I totally agree. I think half the trouble is paranoia about conspiracy theories within our health systems. When an individual claims the mainstream medical community is telling lies, to launder money from selling medications, some individuals believe there is a conspiracy at hand. If these people have ideas which are better than current guidelines, then I'm sure research would be carried out and if beneficial, they would incorporate them.
As a classic example. The National Health Service in the UK runs at a loss. Billions of pound sterling are pumped into the NHS every year. So the medications don't pay for that. In fact, Statins and other drugs cost our NHS millions each year. No conspiracy exists, it's all based on good research. The reason they don't research half the crackpot ideas out there is because they know full well that they will never work.

[erijon]

Yes, I think I can question his knowledge and wisdom. He was a talented physician, but let's not lose sight of the fact that he died of brain cancer at the age of 61, contrary to his practice of mind-body healing and yoga. I think that his tragic death points out that many of his notions of longevity don't necessarily work.

Also, remember that his personal wealth came primarily from the organization he co-founded, the Chopra Center which was used to not only spread his message, but as a selling front for his many books, nutritional products and yoga material. I am always dubious when "enlightened" individuals create websites in which they tag selling their products for profit along with spreading their message. It is just my personal opinion, I have reviewed some of his writings and there is nothing that has not been said before, but he influenced many.

Again, just my 2 cents.

Jon

[Jogeshwar]

"History has proved time and time again, it's the "ONE" who prevails with understanding and knowledge."

David Simon,MD author of many best sellers including 'Wisdom of healing'
and 'Grow Younger, Live Longer: 10 Steps to Reverse Aging' passed away on January 31,2012 at the age of 61. Can any body question his understanding and knowledge? nay. Knowledge becomes wisdom when it is applied successfully and it becomes collective wisdom when it is shared by community

[ed34]

History has proved time and time again, it's the "ONE" who prevails with understanding and knowledge. The "ONE" who stands outside the box and thinks differently. Einstein is a classic example, Nikola Tesla another, the list is very long. It's interesting when you read theories by Einstein such as the speed of light with time being the affected component, there is not one reference to any research of any other scientists in his papers. Pure Genius.

[ed34]

The biggest psychological effect on the heart is anxiety, and there are many people who specialise in this field.