Aa
OT: My daughter went to neuro today...Chiari
Wow, what a visit. Not good. Pediatric neuros aren't any better than the regular neuros we all have seen. I couldn't believe this guy!
When he walked into the room, he stated who he was and shook Baylee's, my mother's and my hand...without looking at any of us. Okay, I did hear he had a terrible bedside manner.
Now i am going to do this like it happened:
Neuro (looking at Baylee): Why are you here?
She looked at me for answers.
Addi: She was diagnosed w....
Neuro interrupted me, still looking at Baylee: I asked her.
Okay. I guess he put me in my place, didn't he? Even though I was taken back by this, I did shut my mouth and watched and listened.
Neuro to Baylee: Why are you here?
Baylee: Because I was diagnosed with Chiari 1 malformation.
Neuro: No, why are you seeing me?
Baylee: Because my regular doctor referred me.
Neuro: No, why are you seeing me?
She looked at me and I was as dumbfounded as she was.
Baylee: Because I am having headaches?
Neuro: Good! Now we are getting somewhere!
He then went on asking her to explain when, where, how, strength, treatments and such regarding her headaches. I continued to keep quiet. For this brief time I was thinking he was doing well getting her to figure out how to explain things. I had already begun doing this with her so i had felt that we were on the same track with Baylee.
That didn't last long.
I accidentally spoke again. My bad. During a break in questions while he was writing, I told him that I had begun teaching Baylee how to keep track of symptoms and....oops, that was all he let me say.
He never looked at me, just said, This is not your visit, it is her visit. I will only address her. He said, this is not up to you, it is up to her to manage her health now.
Guess she isn't allowed guidance for this? That made my tongue slip. I looked at my mom and said, He really does have a terrible bedside manner, doesn't he? I already knew at this point that this visit was a waste of gas and time and a whole day of school for Baylee.
HE FINALLY LOOKED AT ME and said, "you can wait outside." I said, "Absolutely not".
He told Baylee that she has migraines. She will have them for the rest of her life and there was nothing she could do about it. She will give them to her children. He told her he has had migraines since he was 6 years old. He said that there were two types of people in this world...ones who have migraines and understand and ones that don't and will never understand. He waved his hand my mom's and my way and said that they most likely get them and understand. My mom and I said nope at the same time. He said...get this...that is too bad for you two. WHAT? Too bad that we don't get migraines??
She asked him, What about the Chiari? He then asked her to explain what it was. She did....to a t. She has learned. He proceeded to tell her that it means nothing. He told her it does not cause headaches (his whole focus was on headaches...nothing else). He said you can go have surgery for it but you will always still have the headaches...they are migraines.
When i tried to explain about what my neuro had said to me, he said...I am not discussing this with you. SHE is my patient. And I said, and SHE is my DAUGHTER.
Baylee turned to me and asked if we could go. Is she smart or what??
I asked him if he believed in Chiari. No answer. I asked two more times. He finally answered me without looking at me by saying Chiari has nothing to do with this and is not a concern or important. This is about migraines.
I told him that it is not a concern unless the tonsils drop more than 5mm and that Baylee's was 6.5mm. He asked where I got my info and I said from the Chiari Foundation and MY NEURO.
All I heard at that point was blah, blah, blah. I recall my mom asking what about her memory problems (this really is quite concerning as it is causing her to fail her classes when she is an A-B student). Backache, dizziness? All other symptoms were caused by adolescence something and that everyone goes through it. My mom said, I didn't go through it...I said I didn't either.
I quit listening. I said, let's go. We can go to Childrens Hospital in LA. I already checked this and they have three pediatric Chiari specialists there. I already started the process because I knew I would want a second opinion, regardless.
I am really losing so much faith in the medical field. I have seen so many of us go through the bs that my family experienced today. What gets me about this case is that my daughters MRI was NOT normal. It CLEARLY shows her having Chiari.
What a waste of precious spoons...you know?
Addi
When he walked into the room, he stated who he was and shook Baylee's, my mother's and my hand...without looking at any of us. Okay, I did hear he had a terrible bedside manner.
Now i am going to do this like it happened:
Neuro (looking at Baylee): Why are you here?
She looked at me for answers.
Addi: She was diagnosed w....
Neuro interrupted me, still looking at Baylee: I asked her.
Okay. I guess he put me in my place, didn't he? Even though I was taken back by this, I did shut my mouth and watched and listened.
Neuro to Baylee: Why are you here?
Baylee: Because I was diagnosed with Chiari 1 malformation.
Neuro: No, why are you seeing me?
Baylee: Because my regular doctor referred me.
Neuro: No, why are you seeing me?
She looked at me and I was as dumbfounded as she was.
Baylee: Because I am having headaches?
Neuro: Good! Now we are getting somewhere!
He then went on asking her to explain when, where, how, strength, treatments and such regarding her headaches. I continued to keep quiet. For this brief time I was thinking he was doing well getting her to figure out how to explain things. I had already begun doing this with her so i had felt that we were on the same track with Baylee.
That didn't last long.
I accidentally spoke again. My bad. During a break in questions while he was writing, I told him that I had begun teaching Baylee how to keep track of symptoms and....oops, that was all he let me say.
He never looked at me, just said, This is not your visit, it is her visit. I will only address her. He said, this is not up to you, it is up to her to manage her health now.
Guess she isn't allowed guidance for this? That made my tongue slip. I looked at my mom and said, He really does have a terrible bedside manner, doesn't he? I already knew at this point that this visit was a waste of gas and time and a whole day of school for Baylee.
HE FINALLY LOOKED AT ME and said, "you can wait outside." I said, "Absolutely not".
He told Baylee that she has migraines. She will have them for the rest of her life and there was nothing she could do about it. She will give them to her children. He told her he has had migraines since he was 6 years old. He said that there were two types of people in this world...ones who have migraines and understand and ones that don't and will never understand. He waved his hand my mom's and my way and said that they most likely get them and understand. My mom and I said nope at the same time. He said...get this...that is too bad for you two. WHAT? Too bad that we don't get migraines??
She asked him, What about the Chiari? He then asked her to explain what it was. She did....to a t. She has learned. He proceeded to tell her that it means nothing. He told her it does not cause headaches (his whole focus was on headaches...nothing else). He said you can go have surgery for it but you will always still have the headaches...they are migraines.
When i tried to explain about what my neuro had said to me, he said...I am not discussing this with you. SHE is my patient. And I said, and SHE is my DAUGHTER.
Baylee turned to me and asked if we could go. Is she smart or what??
I asked him if he believed in Chiari. No answer. I asked two more times. He finally answered me without looking at me by saying Chiari has nothing to do with this and is not a concern or important. This is about migraines.
I told him that it is not a concern unless the tonsils drop more than 5mm and that Baylee's was 6.5mm. He asked where I got my info and I said from the Chiari Foundation and MY NEURO.
All I heard at that point was blah, blah, blah. I recall my mom asking what about her memory problems (this really is quite concerning as it is causing her to fail her classes when she is an A-B student). Backache, dizziness? All other symptoms were caused by adolescence something and that everyone goes through it. My mom said, I didn't go through it...I said I didn't either.
I quit listening. I said, let's go. We can go to Childrens Hospital in LA. I already checked this and they have three pediatric Chiari specialists there. I already started the process because I knew I would want a second opinion, regardless.
I am really losing so much faith in the medical field. I have seen so many of us go through the bs that my family experienced today. What gets me about this case is that my daughters MRI was NOT normal. It CLEARLY shows her having Chiari.
What a waste of precious spoons...you know?
Addi
JJ - Too funny about your son! Who was he talking to about his MRI? What a kid! I agree with everything you said. I guess when kids hit these higher teen years, people just automatically believe they don't need parents input! I also experienced this issue with her court-ordered counseling (she is on probation). It took some work and plenty of conversations with her counselor, but I am now a part of that, as well. Not completely...just a quick 15 minutes each week to discuss progress or any issues that I, as a parent, believe needs to be addressed.
Alex - thanks for sharing. It is amazing what some of these doctors do to and with patients. It blows me mind so much. Hey, call your neuro and ask him if he wants to take a little vacation to CA? Free room and board in exchange for seeing my daughter. :)
Red - bout time you popped in! Is everything okay with you? Please call or something, gf! Been thinking of you lots!
I write privately...never thought of writing a blog. Don't know how or where to do it. Lol
I am still trying to find out how and where to report this doc. I will redo all the calls I made Friday. But, not today...because it is Monday. Will do tomorrow if no one calls me back.
Thanks for everyones guidance and support in this issue of mine.
Hugs to all,
Addi
Words can't even describe how incredibly angry I am right now. The way he wedged himself between you and your daughter was very odd in my opinion. And asking you to leave-----incredibly wrong!!!
He made huge leaps of reasoning cognitively speaking that it's no wonder there have been suits against him. There are most likely many more than 6 that were settled. Then all that just left and never returned.
Please report him so he can't harm another child.
I am more than angry.
I'm glad that you have found other doctors that will help her.
Have you thought about starting a blog? I can't tell you how many women have contacted me after I wrote about the neuropathic pain doctor incident. Others that met the same doc.
I came back and was so hoping that Baylee had found a specialist
so sorry!
Red
He made huge leaps of reasoning cognitively speaking that it's no wonder there have been suits against him. There are most likely many more than 6 that were settled. Then all that just left and never returned.
Please report him so he can't harm another child.
I am more than angry.
I'm glad that you have found other doctors that will help her.
Have you thought about starting a blog? I can't tell you how many women have contacted me after I wrote about the neuropathic pain doctor incident. Others that met the same doc.
I came back and was so hoping that Baylee had found a specialist
so sorry!
Red
He sounds like my second Neurologist. The first one I went to was leaving town to take another job. He said you have MS you need to have a LP and he handed me over to another Doctor who was a headache specialist, which I did not know. She focused on headaches and ignored all the tests even the ones she sent me for which screamed MS. When I asked why we were not looking at MS she threw my chart at her receptionist and did not make another appointment. She wrote my PCP, swear to God, Patient like having headaches patient does not have MS, patient does not need to see me again.
I do wish you were in the Asheville NC area that first Neurologist is there he is a pediatric Neurologist and very good. He thought I had Chiari before he did a MRI.
Alex
I do wish you were in the Asheville NC area that first Neurologist is there he is a pediatric Neurologist and very good. He thought I had Chiari before he did a MRI.
Alex
COMMUNITY LEADER
Addi,
WTF!!! as my 13 yr old likes to state when something doesn't make any sense. He btw would of gone into full detail, he once spent 30 minutes discussing his MRI when they suspected a brain tumor, he was 7 but he's always been a technical type of kid. My daughter on the other hand would not of been able to speak, 13 or 21 wouldn't of made any difference. She once spent an entire dr visit standing next to the door because she didn't like the dr's tone lol she would of bolted seeing Baylee's doc.
Kids are not the same, they are all different but all 15 year olds no matter how mature they may seem are still scared 'little' kids in the dr's office. Any dr who expects a child of 15 to advocate for themselves in scary serious situations, has no business working with children because they obviously dont understand children! In my books 15 isn't a young women, she's a child.
I'm gob smacked at the way he spoke to you, that seems very strange, as the parent you are an integral part of ensuring the optimum result for the childs health, so why be openly hostile to the only responsible person for the child, i so dont get that.
I can't think of anything to say, it was just wrong on so many levels!
Shocked...........JJ
WTF!!! as my 13 yr old likes to state when something doesn't make any sense. He btw would of gone into full detail, he once spent 30 minutes discussing his MRI when they suspected a brain tumor, he was 7 but he's always been a technical type of kid. My daughter on the other hand would not of been able to speak, 13 or 21 wouldn't of made any difference. She once spent an entire dr visit standing next to the door because she didn't like the dr's tone lol she would of bolted seeing Baylee's doc.
Kids are not the same, they are all different but all 15 year olds no matter how mature they may seem are still scared 'little' kids in the dr's office. Any dr who expects a child of 15 to advocate for themselves in scary serious situations, has no business working with children because they obviously dont understand children! In my books 15 isn't a young women, she's a child.
I'm gob smacked at the way he spoke to you, that seems very strange, as the parent you are an integral part of ensuring the optimum result for the childs health, so why be openly hostile to the only responsible person for the child, i so dont get that.
I can't think of anything to say, it was just wrong on so many levels!
Shocked...........JJ
I was wondering about that...I came back to read it again because the example was SO UNBELIEVABLE and it was gone!!
Craziness.
Craziness.
Ummm. I guess I am more fired up than I thought. My message was removed from here. Ooops! It took me a good long time to write it, too...
Addi
Wow. This makes me SO SAD.
To think of all the kids he has most likely left permanent scars on.
Terrible.
I think I am speechless.
To think of all the kids he has most likely left permanent scars on.
Terrible.
I think I am speechless.
WOW!! ****!!! WAWWW!!
I am just in so much shock at that horrible experience you had with your 15 year old daughter. GEEEZZ!!! I agree with everyone else that you report him to the medical board ASAP! That to me was way beyond bad beside manner, he in my book was being an uneducated, illiterate, chauvinistic A$#HOLE! Sorry for the language but this is so upsetting.
The good thing is that you're strong, kept your cool and put your foot down and got out of there. You daughter seems to be good for herself too :-)
I wish you and your daughter all the best and hope you get better service and answers in LA!
I am just in so much shock at that horrible experience you had with your 15 year old daughter. GEEEZZ!!! I agree with everyone else that you report him to the medical board ASAP! That to me was way beyond bad beside manner, he in my book was being an uneducated, illiterate, chauvinistic A$#HOLE! Sorry for the language but this is so upsetting.
The good thing is that you're strong, kept your cool and put your foot down and got out of there. You daughter seems to be good for herself too :-)
I wish you and your daughter all the best and hope you get better service and answers in LA!
GO GO GO ADDI!!!!!!!!!!!
Get this man you must! You have to for the sake of the emotional disturbance he caused your child and conflicting and confusing information he relayed in addition to his professional misconduct!!!
I would NOT DOUBT that this idiot crack pot neuro schmeuro cheated his way through f'n medical school and that he has lawsuits against him.
Please please follow through with the complaint, not only for you and your mom and your daughter Bailee, but other people who will come after a family seeking help for their child like you.
Im soooooooooooooooo proud too!!!
Get this man you must! You have to for the sake of the emotional disturbance he caused your child and conflicting and confusing information he relayed in addition to his professional misconduct!!!
I would NOT DOUBT that this idiot crack pot neuro schmeuro cheated his way through f'n medical school and that he has lawsuits against him.
Please please follow through with the complaint, not only for you and your mom and your daughter Bailee, but other people who will come after a family seeking help for their child like you.
Im soooooooooooooooo proud too!!!
I'm so fired up about this - I have to post again.
She's a minor! You are in charge of her life until she is 18 years old.
What ever happened to people who were happy parents were an active part of their children's lives? And, were more than happy to answer questions to best help the patient.
I'm proud of you, Addi for maintaining composure throughout.
-shell
She's a minor! You are in charge of her life until she is 18 years old.
What ever happened to people who were happy parents were an active part of their children's lives? And, were more than happy to answer questions to best help the patient.
I'm proud of you, Addi for maintaining composure throughout.
-shell
Thanks, everyone....Julie, Debs and sarahL. I went to the website that Lisa suggested and through it I ended up on the Superior Court website checking to see if he had any civil lawsuits. I wish I would have seen this first because I couldn't believe my eyes when the court showed 6....count them.....6 civil lawsuits against him for medical malpractice!
I thought I had done my homework, but apparently I must have done a half ask job of it. I am so dumbfounded. How is this man still in practice?? I did check the medical board when I researched him...there was nothing bad there. I never even thought of checking for lawsuits! Man oh man.
Yes, I am putting in a call to my insurance....to my daughters pcp....and to the medical board. I don't know what else I can do. Did I cover all the bases here?
Karen, my daughter has my stubbornness and drive. lol This can be a good thing and a bad thing. One thing I have told her since we first saw there was something wrong on her MRI is that she needs to let me know how she feels about the doctor she is seeing. I told her I would never make her see one she was not comfortable with. She remembered that. Imagine that...a teen that actually listened. :)
Yes, the comment about her passing migraines down to her children was a shocker. None of us could believe he said that. Amazing.
ris, I am sorry that you have Chiari. Can I send you a friend request and maybe talk to you privately? My daughter and I both learned up on CM1 when she was diagnosed. A lot of things clicked into place about past things she experienced and didn't really get any answers to. The diagnosis answered those questions. I am so sorry you do experience migraines. I can't imagine how that feels. My daughter gets headaches, but neither of us feel it is migraine at this time. Who knows? Either way, they do effect her everyday. I bet this neuro would talk to you....you fit into his nice little box of people that understand. Suppose to be a joke, even though it really isn't. :/
Sarah, I get it. You and I seem to feel the same on so many subjects. That is something I noticed a long time ago. I can see you and your daughter stepping into our shoes. Thanks.
Shell, Baylee is 15. If I have learned anything on this forum it has been to remain calm. No drama...no stress. I am instilling this into my daughter as well. Well, i did rather blow when we got into the car. :0 I, too, am thankful my mom witnessed this. I just said that to her this morning when I told her about his civil suits.
By the way, I did post the two pictures Baylee let me take of her with the kiddie characters. They are in my album labeled FAMILY. In case you want to check them out.
Thank you all for the support and guidance here. I will also be completing the referral to Childrens Hospital.
Hugs to all,
Addi
I 2nd what LisaJF said and everyone else! I'm too mad for typed words. This is horrifying treatment! This visit should not be paid for and this doc needs to be reported. Call your insurance, everyone you can and get your treatment documented. How old is your daughter again?
OMG woman, I don't know how you maintained your composure. So glad you had your Mom with you too as a witness.
-shell
OMG woman, I don't know how you maintained your composure. So glad you had your Mom with you too as a witness.
-shell
I also am speechless and just cannot beleive that so many doctors have not grasped a simple human life skill..respect and the ability to listen. I can see that perhaps he was trying to allow your daughter to have a voice but if his Mum and Granny are not allowed to speak what is the point of walking through the door. He was extremely rude to you all and if your daughter has learned anything..it is that not all adults set a good example. Thankfully she has a wonderful caring Mum who would do anything for her unlike the ***** (insert your own innuendo) you saw. I also do not often swear but this pushed my button and maybe as I have a 15 year old daughter.
Love and hugs
Sarah x
Love and hugs
Sarah x
What an *-****!
Sorry, you need all the support you can get on this that this doctor is a complete and utter idiot!
I have Chiari - not type one - but the first thing MY NEURO told me - this is one of the things that CAUSES YOUR MIGRAINES!
And there most certainly are things you can do to help prevent or lessen migraines! I've been getting them since I was 18 - so bad that I lose vision, vomit, etc... Now that I have had children, I do not get them as frequently.
Sorry, you need all the support you can get on this that this doctor is a complete and utter idiot!
I have Chiari - not type one - but the first thing MY NEURO told me - this is one of the things that CAUSES YOUR MIGRAINES!
And there most certainly are things you can do to help prevent or lessen migraines! I've been getting them since I was 18 - so bad that I lose vision, vomit, etc... Now that I have had children, I do not get them as frequently.
what a jerk! I think they must go to school to act like this, I have yet to find a neuro with good bedside manners, so sorry your daughter had to experience this, but no way would I leave my child with a jerk like this......or in his care
good luck1
good luck1
What the heck is wrong with this guy? There is so much wrong with that visit. It is absurd and cruel to tell a 15 year-old young woman that she is going to give migraines to her children. He should have asked simple direct questions, like how are you feeling? It's like she was being drilled or having a quiz, and she better get the answer right.
Good for her for asking if she could leave. That dimwit neuro is no match for an adolescent.
I am so sorry this appointment went this way. I have great faith in Children's Hospital in Los Angeles. They should do right by her.
Consider reporting that doctor. What an *-****.
Good for her for asking if she could leave. That dimwit neuro is no match for an adolescent.
I am so sorry this appointment went this way. I have great faith in Children's Hospital in Los Angeles. They should do right by her.
Consider reporting that doctor. What an *-****.
WOAH I'm stunned - literally.
How dare he treat you all like that especially with a 15 year old in the room.
I would most certainly report him without a shadow of doubt.
You needed to have your say as well, because she is only a child. His first round of questions sounded like a bad quiz show:/
Go to LA, and see the other Neuros there.
Way way out of order,
Hugs,
Debs
How dare he treat you all like that especially with a 15 year old in the room.
I would most certainly report him without a shadow of doubt.
You needed to have your say as well, because she is only a child. His first round of questions sounded like a bad quiz show:/
Go to LA, and see the other Neuros there.
Way way out of order,
Hugs,
Debs
***!!! I am totally speechless. Swearing is not something I do but felt it was totally appropriate under the circumstances. You should complain about that dr to whatever medical board there is to complain to.
You handled this so well. Be proud of yourself and your daughter. Thank goodness you guys have each other cause that is one might messed up dr.
Thanks for sharing the story and thanks for showing us how to be our own best advocates for ourselves and our children.
Julie
You handled this so well. Be proud of yourself and your daughter. Thank goodness you guys have each other cause that is one might messed up dr.
Thanks for sharing the story and thanks for showing us how to be our own best advocates for ourselves and our children.
Julie
Thank you, JSSL. She has had to grow up pretty fast....between me and now herself. I really hoped this neuro would have been good to and for her. I think this quack was worse than any that I have seen. :(
Addi
I will go check out that link, Lisa. Thank you. We all three walked out of there pretty stunned and pissed off. We had to start joking or we would have exploded...that is how we are. Try to make some lightness in, ya know?
On another funny note, the exam rooms were made for younguns. My daughters exam table was a big dinosaur. She is 15. I couldn't believe she would let me take a picture of her sitting on it, but she did! :)
We stopped and had dinner. They had some helium balloons. they also had a bee character handing them out to little ones. I told Baylee if she let me get her picture with him, she could have the balloon. OMG if she didn't agree. lol
When we got in the truck, she untied the balloon and sucked in some air and said, "I talk this way because I have migraines". Then she laughed. It sounded so funny! My belly was hurting.... :)
Addi
Addi -
UNBELIEVABLE.
I am so sorry. How terrible for your daughter to have to witness this first hand. At least she has a great teacher in you to follow through with all of this BS. Good luck with the hospital in LA.
You and your family are in my thoughts.
JSSL
UNBELIEVABLE.
I am so sorry. How terrible for your daughter to have to witness this first hand. At least she has a great teacher in you to follow through with all of this BS. Good luck with the hospital in LA.
You and your family are in my thoughts.
JSSL
Oh yeah. I forgot to say that when I got Baylee's C-spine MRI back, it said her C5 and C6 vertebras were fused together. I do remember my mom asking about that, too. The neuro said this, too, was nothing to worry about.
Does anyone here know if this should be any concern for me?
OMFG!!!!!!!!!
Report this man!!!!!!!!
http://www.ama-assn.org/ama/pub/physician-resources/medical-ethics/code-medical-ethics/frequently-asked-questions.page
Please please I beg of you!!!
Thank god you got up and walked out. How dare he!
Im so glad you already started the process of going to the Childrens Hospital in LA. Dont lose faith, sooner or later you will get someone that will fulfill their duty as a medical professional and has a good bedside manner!!! Jesus!
Lisa
Report this man!!!!!!!!
http://www.ama-assn.org/ama/pub/physician-resources/medical-ethics/code-medical-ethics/frequently-asked-questions.page
Please please I beg of you!!!
Thank god you got up and walked out. How dare he!
Im so glad you already started the process of going to the Childrens Hospital in LA. Dont lose faith, sooner or later you will get someone that will fulfill their duty as a medical professional and has a good bedside manner!!! Jesus!
Lisa
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