Your definition of "Clean"

[worried878]

K...was reading a post and it made me stop and think....if someone is on sub or methadone, are they considered clean?  I never did feel i was "clean" when i took sub..but then again when i used it my intentions werent to qquit narcotics..only to avoid wds..just thinkin bout it cos sub, methadone, oxy and hydro..and more..are all narcotics...would u be clean if u were on tramadol after quitting your doc?  It is narcotic like they say...but can be a doc for many..as can sub and methadone....in a way for some it seems like it could just about be "clean" for them cos their lifestyle has changed so much for the better when they quit chasing their doc...opinions????

[broknbck]

so what is the definition of clean?
who cares.
it is a big step when someone stops abusing drugs
and then it is another when they are free and not addicted to anything.
i think some people are fooled at first when taking the sub or methadone that they are drug free and not struggling with cravings. not realizing that is only because they are still getting the drug.

so it is the freedom that we all want to have and help each other with.

[LateAugust]

I agree with you 100%, just as one  must own their  addiction,  you must also own your recovery.  What works for me, may not be the same that worked for you, or for what works for XXXXX.

I only wish we could get  past the  judgemental attitudes of what didn't work for others  and give words of encouragement for whatever path one takes into the journey of sobriety.

I have been "dawged, debated" for believing 12 step programs are very important .......  or gosh that I think aftercare is paramount to continuing recovery,  polar opposite to many I also believe   Suboxone has a place in recovery as well, with good, competent and qualified  medical care and intensive on going treatment.

Not popular here, but my daughter was only able to focus and stop the cycle of  relapses with Suboxone, in-patient treatment (3rd time,  but the first with sub)  followed by extensive IOP treatment,  group therapy and NA/AA.   She is close to 5 months  and yes I call it sober    as does her counselor  as well as her AA sponsor that has been a godsend.     I am so very thankful  she has not been judged as some here have been, I truly believe she was too sick and fragile  and a complete mental mess to decipher  the "wrong from right"  w/d detox aftercare etc recommendations and on going debates.      Why cant we all just agree that we are all individuals and a cookie cutter approach to recovery really doesn't exist?

[CATUF]

Is the Man on the Flying Trapeze really on a flying trapeze if he has a safety net under him?

For the first year of my recovery I was subject to random and very frequent drug screens.  Literally, there was no way I could have used even once and not had it detected.  And a dirty test would have meant HUGE BAD things and major loses.

That was good, but it took care of the mental twist that told me "you can use just a little, just this once, and it won't hurt anything."  It was clear to me that any use would destroy EVERYTHING . . . even if it didn't lead back to full blow active addiction (which of course it would have).

That was a big help to me.  I never, ever decided to throw my life in the toilet.  It always ended up there, somehow, after I had done a harmless little something that I wasn't going to let get out of control (again).  

There came a time when I thought for a while that I didn't have much of a Recovery, since it was clear I would have relapsed long ago without the tests.  It semed I should (somehow) get out of the testing so that my Recovery could stand on its own two feet and show what it was made of.  

Lucky for me I was able to nip that idea in the bud and realize that Recovery isn't about doing it the hardway, or all by myself, etc.  Whatever I needed to get me into sustained Recovery is what I needed.

There are no points given for getting there with less help.  Recovery is about saving a life.  It's not about toughing it out.  It's not about being good or bad. Recovery is about returning to life and to relationship with self, God and others.  

CATUF
1466

[122 Tactical Fighter Group]

I think people kick this poor tired topic around too much.  Does it really make a bunch of difference to anyone but the direct participant? Its good to disseminate information.....but other than that I could care less what route another uses to get it together again. Maybe more people should try the ibogaine?

[Ernie_420]

I have been on methadone 4 2 months.  I feel better than ever but don't think I'm truly clean.  I have tried everything else and nothing worked.  It has truly been a lifesaver.  The problem now is kicking the methadone. Any help

[dominosarah]

This is only my opinion and the way i feel about my recovery......I am opiate free so therefore i am clean.           sara

[kim715]

I went the methadone route and I didn't consider myself to be clean while I was on it.I'm not judging anyone else,everyones recovery is their own,but for me I didn't start counting clean days until I was off everything.All the best...Kim

[Kevin_Bacon]

I've never gone the Sub/Methadone route, but if I did, I'd consider myself clean, with one note-to-self: I'm off the pills/powder/whatever that were wrecking my life, and seriously making a huge effort to stay that way.

So, if it's an issue of ethics to you, you're clean of the drug(s) that got you there.

When you taper off the replacement-therapy, if your consultations (note plural) indicate that you won't need sub or Meth beyond a certain point, then you'll be "drug-free."

I hope this is the way it plays out for you. I wouldn't be wading into that philosophical swamp at this time, just concentrating/preparing for no more drugs, if that's your goal.

It's just my opinion, and I just thought about your question and started typing ... should be interesting to see what others have to say here.

Hope it works out for you.

[stilltrying1965]

if you are getting onother drug like meth i dont consider it clean time i feel its just a stop gap my doctor offered me meth on tuesday but i refused i consider clean time when your body has no opaites in it heroin is an opiate so if i took meth or any of the formentioned then how can we say we are clean clean time to me means no opiates what so ever in our bodies although it would help a lot of people who struggle to get clean i hope that makes some scence

[outotown]

I used sub. to get clean I was under the care of a DR and did everything he said, so yes I consiserd myslef clean, or better said in recovery, I knew I was on a narcotic, but was useing it as a tool in my recovery. If I were using it just to but w/d at bay untill I could get more of my doc then no I would not have consisderd my self as clean or better said in recovery.

[imanaddict]

This topic has been debated so many times and you will get TONS of different views. I am on sub due to a nasty Norco habit of 40 to 60 Norco a day, but I consider myself "clean". Clean from the Norco.