Just a few thoughts on autoimmunity

[KellyMGo]

I could have put this topic in about 4 autoimmune categories.  I have 4 AD so far, diagnosed, and that's not counting *what I believe to be MS* and who knows what else.

Just a few thoughts about autoimmune diseases...

It drives me crazy thinking, should I avoid Gluten?  Was it all of the vaccinations I received?  Was it because I never had Chicken Pox (or the anti-body), despite being exposed to it repeatedly as a child, as an adult, and even had the vaccination for it while I was pregnant?  And yet, no anti-body for it is still in me.  Is it because the world is so clean, that our immune systems go into a recluse phase because they don't think they have to work as hard?  Is it molecular mimicry, like in Rheumatic Fever, in ALL cases, but we just don't know that?  Is it because hormonal birth control was invented?  It is something in the plastic, the water, the environment?  Or, is it THAT easy to say, we don't know, it's "probably" a combination of things?  

Your thoughts?  

[FancyPantsandMe]

Something I came across on Dr. Fuhrman's site...a direct answer to a woman's question about autoimmune disease...read what he wrote in response...

QUESTION:
Can you tell me what is the relationship between wheat or dairy (animal product) and auto-immune disease such as Lupus?, why is it that these should not be consummed at all? Since starting Eat To Live last April I have had a great reduction of symptoms triggered by sun exposure. Even when using a high SPF sunblock, I still get skin blisters but they are rare, small, and heal faster, and not accompanied by arthritic pain, anemia, or extreme fatigue and forgetfulness. It seems that when I have even small amounts of wheat (like a small round of pita bread or 1/2 a glass of skim milk) I am more prone to react to sun exposure. Am I correct? What is the underlying mechanism?

When the auto-immune disease is completely revesed, when all test results are normal and when there is no flare-up following sun exposure, can small, occasional amounts or wheator dairy be re-introduced in the diet whithout negative side effects?

Thank you very much for your book and for this forum, it is much much appreciated.

ANSWER:
This is an incredibly complicated and not understood subject and there are multiple (poorly understood) reasons, plus I could write an entire book on this subject and do not want to do that here. But, if anyone thinks they have all the answers to this one, don't believe it.
Besides the immunogenic stimulation from partially digested animal proteins (peptides) Mycobacterium avium paratuberculosis bacteria survives pasteurization and is found in most milk. This bacteria can promote an immune response and eventually trigger and autoimmune cascade. Dairy also can promote an unfavorable balance of bacterial species that may elaborate toxic compounds. Dairy fat is also our richest source of dioxin and other petrochemicals whose consumption is linked to thyroid disease, endometriosis and other medical conditions. Certain fish may have more pollution in it, but since dairy is consumed so much more than fatty fish and shellfish, dairy is the largest contributor to our body's toxic load. In addition, many studies illustrate IGF-1 is a potent stimulus for breast cancer cell proliferation, and that it exerts local growth promoting effects. The higher levels of IGF may also promote the imbalanced immune system response seen in autoimmune diseases. However IGF-1 alone, does not adequately explain the risk; rather it is synergy between more IGF-1, toxic chemicals, estrogen, dairy protein, saturated fat and the industry-related milk additives. Dairy and wheat peptides are simply the most common food allergens and so many people improve their health when reducing or eliminating these foods. Unless you grind your own wheat berries, flour also contains rodent droppings and other sensitizing elements.

You were astute to realize that feeling better does not really mean you are totally well yet, that takes years. After a few years of nutritional excellence, you will be able to tolerate a small degree of toxic exposure without the same (severe) reaction. At that point it can take a few months of dietary abuse rather than a few hours to get yourself ill again. JF

[JenB12]

heh yeah it is all very complex to say the least.

I saw the stuff from Janet Lang that you posted months ago..... VERY interesting. I liked her.

Please let me know as things go along with your friend with Cancer, and how her journey goes sans meat. I hope she does very well! :)

[FancyPantsandMe]

Check out the video on the *************website with their son...you shouldn't be putting the carrot in your drink in the morning. ;-)  carrots are starch...not good with fruits and greens :-)

~Amy~
I'm so outta here now lol

[FancyPantsandMe]

Ok had to respond...geez I'm so behind today! lol


I won't argue...just want to see you be as healthy as you can be...the molecular mimicry with animal protein is explained by two doctors in Fasting and Eating for Health and The China Study.


Most vegetarians don't feel well because they don't mix up and constantly change the greens they are eating.  Victoria covers this in her DVD's..but something happens in the body with oxcylic acid( spelling?)..when you eat the same grees over and over again you get "poisoned" by these acids. You must always be mixing up the greens. She explains it better than i can here...and most vegetarians are not eating a balance of foods. they don't have enough hydrochloric acid in their digestive systems and they are TOO acidic.  Not sure what you were eating at the time, but there is a lot of evidence in what she has to say.  They were raw for about 7 years and then they all ( all 4 of them, her and her husband and two kids) became sick and she couldn't figure out why...did her reasearch on the green leafy vegetables ( and she classifies the vegetables seperate from the GREENS, she said the greens are not vegetables they are greens...she's a Russian woman and extremly funny) and found out about the oxcylic acid. They changed up the greens every week and now they are back to being healthy again. She covers their story in the DVD's..also you can find them at *********com

It's just an option to try...

I won't bring it up again.

It isn't as simple as balancing out the hormones with food..but when we give our bodies what they need ( and figuring out this is the "fun" for each individual, because we are all different) they heal.  This I know to be true.

Check out ************** Dr. Janet Lang has done tons of research and work in the area of balancing out the hormones.  I see one of her co-doctors Dr. Doris Compton in New Haven, Missouri.

A point about Cancer..
In the DVD ( just got this one two weeks ago) Healing Cancer from Inside Out...the doctors on this DVD talk about an enzyme that is produced by the Pancreas.  This enzymes main purpose is to break down the sheath that "hides" the cancer cell from the bodies immune system.  This was to be it's only job.  However...doctors have found that in populations where there is a HIGH intake of animal protein..this enzyme has adapted to breaking down animal protein..and furthermore, what they found was that when the presence of animal protein is in the body it's sole purpose then is to deal with the animal protein and NOT the sheath around the cancer cells.  ALSO with further research they noticed when people stopped eating animal protein...the enzyme MORPHED back to an enzyme that broke down the sheath around the cancer cell so the bodies immune system could once again recognize it.  

This was NEW information for me.  And one I am researching.  I have a friend right now that has a rare pancreatic cancer...and she is going to stop eating animal protein for 6 weeks. We'll see what happens.

Life is a wonderful journey!
~Amy~

[JenB12]

Thanks for the suggestion, but no thanks on eliminating meats. :)  I was vegetarian for a year and a half and I really did not like the way I felt. I enjoy meat too much. As it stands now I don't eat significant amounts of meat. Broccoli does not have "complete proteins" meaning the 8 different amino acids that meats have. I don't want to start an argument about which is better being an omnivore vs not eating meats, because I think there is value in both. But it's not likely that I'm going to go vegetarian again.

I do have green shakes 2 x a day once in the morning for breakfast and once at night. My smoothies have kale, spinach, carrot, banana, water, (mixed fruits depending on the day), papaya, juice and romaine lettuce. (I don't put spirulina algae in there yet like my husband, I have yet to develop a taste for that haha.)

As for what causes hormonal imbalances... I'm sure many many things. As for food? yes i think it can cause hormonal imbalances. Like fats can increase estrogen as one example. I do know that estrogen is also stored in body fats as well.

I was not really referring so much to hormonal imbalances, as much as I believe that hormones are the part of the cause. Hormones are the chemicals/ proteins that tell organs what to do and what to make, so it makes sense that any number of things can go wrong with the message that the hormone sends. It's too complex for me to really understand all of it or to explain it here. There are SO many different hormones that do so many different things in each part of the body and are critical for our proper functioning... it's amazing really.

Also even if Hormones are in balance sometimes diseases grow in response to them. For examples, some cancers are estrogen reactive.

I believe that it is not as simple as balancing out hormones with food. There are too many things that can disrupt hormone production. Hashimotos being a prime example. Or something like Cushings disease where a lesion on the pituitary causes the extra hormones to be sent to the adrenals which increases cortisol production. In addition, there are many things that can go wrong with any hormone producing gland or organ that can cause a hormonal imbalance that diet cannot help.

My point in adding that I thought that hormones had something to do with causing autoimmune disease was that it would certainly explain why women of child bearing age are so much more likely to get certain autoimmune conditions vs. men. The difference between the sexes is the hormones that we produce. Just a thought. It's clearly not the answer to it all, after all my brother and i both have autoimmune diseases and we're different sexes.

Bottom line, I agree with you that hormonal balance is critical and that for most people, good diet is important. One needs to look no further then to insulin and glucagon to see how critical diet is to insuring that everything functions properly. My only point to mentioning hormones in the first place is that hormonal differences and genetics must be at least part of the explanation as to why certain demographics are more likely to have an autoimmune condition.

[FancyPantsandMe]

Hi,
Needed to clarify the statement about people wanting to be sick.

What I meant by that was, in my practice, I have found people, mostly women who have grown up in a "victim" mentality.  Therefore they think "all things are done TO them" ( including illness, mostly as a punishment for something they did wrong) that they have no control over.  They don't know how to NOT be sick..and being sick is easier than getting well, because one has to be empowered to a certain extent to take their health matters into their own hands and become responsible for their lifestyle choices. You see this in the "battered woman syndrome" as well.  It's easier to stay with the batterer than it is to try and take care of herself and children in some instances. CHANGE is NOT EASY for most people.  In fact most people would rather take a pill than change their lifestyle even if it means that they would be well and full of energy and happy.  This is a very SAD fact.  But it is one I find over and over and over again in the classes and workshops I teach. I have found if I can help shift the paradigm that people live with about disease and health I can help them to make lasting changes in thier lives that benefit not only themselves but those around them as well.

I once met a gal in one of my workshops who said it was easier for her to have asthma than it was NOT to have it because someone else was "footing the bill"..and if she "cured" herself of the disease she would no longer have someone else paying for everything, she would have to go to work and be responsible for the bills once again.
In her case it was determined that the kind of work she was doing CAUSED the asthma..so therefore she was able to have someone else ( i guess the company) pay for her living expenses etc. the rest of her life.  She didn't want to get well.  She said "are you crazy? why would I want to be well?"  Absolultley blew me away!! lol

So just wanted to clarify that point.

~Amy~
Now I'm outta here and into town...lol