Aa
doc said "no lyme" (i am doubting this but what do you do?)-natural antibiotics??
so i have decided to try natural antibiotics. i am not good at taking anything resembling pills or vitamins but i thought i would try 3 natural antibiotics and see if that might improve my symptoms. my question is does anyone know the dosage for oil of oregano (liquid concentrate), olive leaf extract (liq. conc) and cat's claw (also liquid conc)? i found a website naming the 10 most potent natural antibiotics for lyme. i could never do all 10 and be consistent so i thought try 3 for a few months then go to 3 different ones. there is dosing for 2 out of the 3 but the oil of oregano there is not instructions......any comments??
Your symptoms in my opinion are definitely lyme and/or co-infections as I had many of the same symptoms in the beginning. The tests for Lyme are not effective. I truly feel for you.
Besides,I think your odds for a black widow bite are far less than for a tick given the epidemic of Lyme.What you are describing is not fibromyalgia and the elevated WBC does indicate your body is trying to fight an infection. Natural antibiotics will help until you can find a LLMD who can treat you based on clinical symptms. I agree the out of pocket costs are a disgrace.
Besides,I think your odds for a black widow bite are far less than for a tick given the epidemic of Lyme.What you are describing is not fibromyalgia and the elevated WBC does indicate your body is trying to fight an infection. Natural antibiotics will help until you can find a LLMD who can treat you based on clinical symptms. I agree the out of pocket costs are a disgrace.
sorry for a long reply.....read the following and see my symptoms.....saw 3 different docs.....the latest lab tests were lyme titer (elisa im sure) cbc, other stuff which is normal....the white blood cells slightly elevated....my latest doc was infectious disease doc. he was great but seemingly familiar with the basics of lyme. at this point i am out of money to go see a llmd...insurance has left me with $4000 of uncovered tests and procedures and i gotta pay that off before i even consider the llmd which is 5 hours away. infectious disease doc said "if" it was lyme the bite is so far in the past (over a year) that there is no therapy ( i disagree) to be done. no tests done for co infections. so thats why i was considering natural antibiotics.
Years of pain with a"half hearted" dx of Fibro, I now suspect it could be Lyme Here are my symptoms which have been consistent for at least a 3 months. I have dealt with it thinking it was all contributed to the FMS dx but I am second guessing that.....
I have noticed that upon waking before I get out of bed I will shake or vibrate as if chilling, this lasts only a few seconds. This also happens right before I fall asleep.
Flushed or hot feeling as with a fever but when I take temp it is normal or slightly below
Constant cramps in toes and fingers
Feel like I am getting the flu after outdoor activities, lymph node tenderness, achey, scratchy throat sometimes, feverish, next day I will develop a fever blister
worse symptoms preceding menstruation
Periods coming about every 2 ½ weeks and terrible pms including cramps headaches severe irritability-this seems to be worsening
Blurry vision as if looking through a pair of dirty or smeared eye glasses also at times my eyes will feel hot or watery or dry and irritated or red
Brain fog
Burning sensation under skin
Itchy skin not due to bites which sometimes is worse at night or laying in bed
Rib soreness mainly left front ribs
Sore skin as with a sunburn various places and intermittent
Sore skin in areas such as lymph node tenderness in neck, throat, collar bones, arm pits, breasts, chest
Chilling sensations in legs
Left arm from elbow to wrist flashing sensation of pins and needles and feeling like the circulation is being cut off for a second then allowed to flow again (uncomfortable but not really painful)
Difficulty reading (I have to read things several times before it “clicks”)
Have trouble hearing and have to ask people “what?” sometimes I will just try to process it in my head before I asked them to repeat their selves…I hear it but it doesn’t always compute???
Sharp ear pain which comes and goes ringing in ears which also is here and there
Floaters and flashes of light in eyes mostly left side (sometimes this is worse when I move my head quickly) and have experienced light flash when there is a loud noise
Occasionally when walking one foot will “catch” of the floor and I will stumble but not fall (if this happens once then that day I will do it multiple times)
I tend to topple a little to the left side while standing or as I begin to walk until I get going
Fatigue and exhaustion not relieved by sleep
Heavy feeling arms and legs like they are made of concrete
Shoulder pain continually on left side and to the bottom of ribs to my spine
Feeling like my spine is too short for my body and pulling sensations in spine when I turn my head or bend
Same feeling in my eyes-like the optic nerve is too short and have eye pain when I turn my eyes
Rice crispies popping and cracking, gurgling feeling in neck when I turn head
Fever sometimes daily 99*
Joint pain almost continually in fingers and toes
Inside of knees joints continually hurt
Finger joints on left hand index finger swollen and painful now moving to the right hand, very end of my fingers hurt and first joint pain is constant
Left knee upon waking with feel hot from the inside out and there is some fluid on knee, odd feeling in that leg from knee down
Intermittent ankle pain
Bottoms of feet feel swollen and painful when walking especially upon waking or from sitting
Tingly feeling in lips, fingers and toes
Numbness in left shoulder/back area
Light headed especially upon standing
Bladder spasms and sometimes painful urination which causes me to wince
A couple of times felt like the room flip flopped upside down
Depression (on and off for years)
Anxious feeling
Insomnia
Short term memory problems (sometimes I can’t recall something I did yesterday)
Sinus issues, stuffiness, constant clearing throat, excess mucus
Stabbing pains or shooting pains and sensations (may be down arm or legs)
Restless Leg especially if I take any medication with a sedative affect such as benedryl
Restless Leg sensations in chest and arms
Waking up to clinched arms and teeth
Muscles feel like they lock when I stretch
Tearful, weepy feeling
Twitching eyes/lids
Unable to find words I am looking for
Cold hands and feet sometimes even when the weather is warm
I cannot tolerate cooler temps-I will chill and cannot warm up
Unusual pain in various places which may last a week or 2 then be completely gone
Gurgling in stomach, bloating feeling, bowel urgency but unproductive
Ovarian pain (cysts)
Frequently find myself sitting or laying in uncomfortable positions and not realizing it until it has become very painful
Low back pain
Facial swelling and fluid retention in lips and eyelids (not sure if it is noticeable to others) also in hands and feet
Feeling like my speech is slurring and hearing this but not noticeable to others
Skin sensitivity to touch
Forget what I am about to say and inability to recall words or events
fever blisters/gum sores
light sensitivity in eyes
Ear sensitivity to loud or sudden noise
Burning pain in various spots sometimes relieved by moving
Heart fluttering especially when laying on my left side
Left side of body feeling like it is “weaker”
Pain that starts on one side of body, lasting a week or so then slowly subsiding migrating to opposite side of body (mirror image pain)
Easy bruising or mystery bruising
Joint pain that sometimes has itching or burning sensation
I feel like my brain is overloaded with stimuli such as noises, people talking to me, crowds, trying to make decisions, etc and it puts me into a panic mode making me anxious, irritated and ready to snap
Within the past month I have developed a tic or twitch where my head will nod to the left (this is not noticeable to others)
Occasionally when I focus on an object it appears to vibrate
Out of the blue sleepy feeling to the point I feel like I have taken a sleeping pill or drank too much alcohol, I actually feel drunk. This lasts a few minutes or so then it is gone.
Detached feeling from surroundings or my own body
Sometimes an area on my body (when I touch it) will not feel like it is my own
I have to add that Sept 09 I had been bitten by something in the calf of my leg, which made me sick with flu like symptoms. I did have a huge red circular rash which itched at first then burned and 8 hours later swelled, was hot and painful. It extended over the shin/calf area and I went to the doctor next day. Said it looked like a black widow bite. A round of antibiotics (Leviquen) cured it I thought and within a week my symptoms were gone except for the bruising that the swelling caused. The pain was so intense at the bite area that I literally had trouble walking.
In August of this year after being bitten by 30 or 40 mosquitoes when I was in CT visiting family I came home and one week later spent the night in the ER after I become acutely ill with 103* fever, muscle pain and cramps, numbness in lips, face and extremities, severe and sudden headache, chills, sweats, hands and arms along with toes and lips drawing like I was a stroke victim. I have experienced list of symptoms above consistently from Aug 2010.
I have noticed that upon waking before I get out of bed I will shake or vibrate as if chilling, this lasts only a few seconds. This also happens right before I fall asleep.
Flushed or hot feeling as with a fever but when I take temp it is normal or slightly below
Constant cramps in toes and fingers
Feel like I am getting the flu after outdoor activities, lymph node tenderness, achey, scratchy throat sometimes, feverish, next day I will develop a fever blister
worse symptoms preceding menstruation
Periods coming about every 2 ½ weeks and terrible pms including cramps headaches severe irritability-this seems to be worsening
Blurry vision as if looking through a pair of dirty or smeared eye glasses also at times my eyes will feel hot or watery or dry and irritated or red
Brain fog
Burning sensation under skin
Itchy skin not due to bites which sometimes is worse at night or laying in bed
Rib soreness mainly left front ribs
Sore skin as with a sunburn various places and intermittent
Sore skin in areas such as lymph node tenderness in neck, throat, collar bones, arm pits, breasts, chest
Chilling sensations in legs
Left arm from elbow to wrist flashing sensation of pins and needles and feeling like the circulation is being cut off for a second then allowed to flow again (uncomfortable but not really painful)
Difficulty reading (I have to read things several times before it “clicks”)
Have trouble hearing and have to ask people “what?” sometimes I will just try to process it in my head before I asked them to repeat their selves…I hear it but it doesn’t always compute???
Sharp ear pain which comes and goes ringing in ears which also is here and there
Floaters and flashes of light in eyes mostly left side (sometimes this is worse when I move my head quickly) and have experienced light flash when there is a loud noise
Occasionally when walking one foot will “catch” of the floor and I will stumble but not fall (if this happens once then that day I will do it multiple times)
I tend to topple a little to the left side while standing or as I begin to walk until I get going
Fatigue and exhaustion not relieved by sleep
Heavy feeling arms and legs like they are made of concrete
Shoulder pain continually on left side and to the bottom of ribs to my spine
Feeling like my spine is too short for my body and pulling sensations in spine when I turn my head or bend
Same feeling in my eyes-like the optic nerve is too short and have eye pain when I turn my eyes
Rice crispies popping and cracking, gurgling feeling in neck when I turn head
Fever sometimes daily 99*
Joint pain almost continually in fingers and toes
Inside of knees joints continually hurt
Finger joints on left hand index finger swollen and painful now moving to the right hand, very end of my fingers hurt and first joint pain is constant
Left knee upon waking with feel hot from the inside out and there is some fluid on knee, odd feeling in that leg from knee down
Intermittent ankle pain
Bottoms of feet feel swollen and painful when walking especially upon waking or from sitting
Tingly feeling in lips, fingers and toes
Numbness in left shoulder/back area
Light headed especially upon standing
Bladder spasms and sometimes painful urination which causes me to wince
A couple of times felt like the room flip flopped upside down
Depression (on and off for years)
Anxious feeling
Insomnia
Short term memory problems (sometimes I can’t recall something I did yesterday)
Sinus issues, stuffiness, constant clearing throat, excess mucus
Stabbing pains or shooting pains and sensations (may be down arm or legs)
Restless Leg especially if I take any medication with a sedative affect such as benedryl
Restless Leg sensations in chest and arms
Waking up to clinched arms and teeth
Muscles feel like they lock when I stretch
Tearful, weepy feeling
Twitching eyes/lids
Unable to find words I am looking for
Cold hands and feet sometimes even when the weather is warm
I cannot tolerate cooler temps-I will chill and cannot warm up
Unusual pain in various places which may last a week or 2 then be completely gone
Gurgling in stomach, bloating feeling, bowel urgency but unproductive
Ovarian pain (cysts)
Frequently find myself sitting or laying in uncomfortable positions and not realizing it until it has become very painful
Low back pain
Facial swelling and fluid retention in lips and eyelids (not sure if it is noticeable to others) also in hands and feet
Feeling like my speech is slurring and hearing this but not noticeable to others
Skin sensitivity to touch
Forget what I am about to say and inability to recall words or events
fever blisters/gum sores
light sensitivity in eyes
Ear sensitivity to loud or sudden noise
Burning pain in various spots sometimes relieved by moving
Heart fluttering especially when laying on my left side
Left side of body feeling like it is “weaker”
Pain that starts on one side of body, lasting a week or so then slowly subsiding migrating to opposite side of body (mirror image pain)
Easy bruising or mystery bruising
Joint pain that sometimes has itching or burning sensation
I feel like my brain is overloaded with stimuli such as noises, people talking to me, crowds, trying to make decisions, etc and it puts me into a panic mode making me anxious, irritated and ready to snap
Within the past month I have developed a tic or twitch where my head will nod to the left (this is not noticeable to others)
Occasionally when I focus on an object it appears to vibrate
Out of the blue sleepy feeling to the point I feel like I have taken a sleeping pill or drank too much alcohol, I actually feel drunk. This lasts a few minutes or so then it is gone.
Detached feeling from surroundings or my own body
Sometimes an area on my body (when I touch it) will not feel like it is my own
I have to add that Sept 09 I had been bitten by something in the calf of my leg, which made me sick with flu like symptoms. I did have a huge red circular rash which itched at first then burned and 8 hours later swelled, was hot and painful. It extended over the shin/calf area and I went to the doctor next day. Said it looked like a black widow bite. A round of antibiotics (Leviquen) cured it I thought and within a week my symptoms were gone except for the bruising that the swelling caused. The pain was so intense at the bite area that I literally had trouble walking.
In August of this year after being bitten by 30 or 40 mosquitoes when I was in CT visiting family I came home and one week later spent the night in the ER after I become acutely ill with 103* fever, muscle pain and cramps, numbness in lips, face and extremities, severe and sudden headache, chills, sweats, hands and arms along with toes and lips drawing like I was a stroke victim. I have experienced list of symptoms above consistently from Aug 2010.
My LLMD had me start on some of the naturals (samento, to be specific) while waiting for tests. He also feels that starting in that way can help the body prepare for antibiotic treatment.
I agree that naturals alone will not cure you, but they can be a good place to start, especially if there will be a wait before seeing a Lyme doc. The longer Lyme and co-infections go untreated, the more deeply rooted and difficult to eradicate they become, so I can understand the desire to do something in the meantime while you are waiting.
I agree that naturals alone will not cure you, but they can be a good place to start, especially if there will be a wait before seeing a Lyme doc. The longer Lyme and co-infections go untreated, the more deeply rooted and difficult to eradicate they become, so I can understand the desire to do something in the meantime while you are waiting.
I can't disagree with ree4tu1. There are those of us who can't tolerate the antibiotics for one reason or another, but getting a full diagnosis and discussion of treatment with an LLMD would be my first recommendation too.
If you don't have Lyme, good.
If you do, I would go for the antibiotics. If you can't tolerate those for some reason, then herbal becomes more significant as a possibility.
If you don't have Lyme, good.
If you do, I would go for the antibiotics. If you can't tolerate those for some reason, then herbal becomes more significant as a possibility.
If it is lyme, in my opinion, do not mess around with the "natural antibiotics"in the beginning stages of lyme. Go right for the real antibiotics and see an Lyme Literate MD.
Well, the diagnosis is good news, if you don't in fact have Lyme or a coinfection.
What tests were you given, and what at the results? If you weren't given copies of the test results, I strongly suggest you call the docs office and ask them to mail you complete copies of ALL tests run, whatever the doc got back from the lab.
Share the results with us, if you would like kibbitzing to commence. If you don't know what you have, it's difficult to know what treatments (herbal or otherwise) to take.
As to herbal and other alternative treatments, look for Bryan Rosner's books and also those by Stephen Buhner.
Rosner is not a doc, but has an inquisitive mind and writes extensively about Lyme and all the various treatments, both in books and online.
Buhner is a serious herbalist, and while I have no yardstick to measure herbalists by, I find him well worth reading.
As to cat's claw, there is a difference of opinion over whether cat's claw or a derivative of it called Samento is a better treatment. I have not formed an opinion on that point.
If you can find an herbalist/naturopath/whatever to work with, I would suggest you consider it, because the synergies among the selection of herbs you pick may not be as beneficial as a different combo. As in: I like chocolate, cinnamon and mint; all three of them in the same dish might be good, and chocolate with either of them might be good, but cinnamon and mint together might be bit jarring. Not everything works together.
No on ehere is medicallly trained that I know of, but we're happy to share our experiences and thoughts.
Best wishes --
What tests were you given, and what at the results? If you weren't given copies of the test results, I strongly suggest you call the docs office and ask them to mail you complete copies of ALL tests run, whatever the doc got back from the lab.
Share the results with us, if you would like kibbitzing to commence. If you don't know what you have, it's difficult to know what treatments (herbal or otherwise) to take.
As to herbal and other alternative treatments, look for Bryan Rosner's books and also those by Stephen Buhner.
Rosner is not a doc, but has an inquisitive mind and writes extensively about Lyme and all the various treatments, both in books and online.
Buhner is a serious herbalist, and while I have no yardstick to measure herbalists by, I find him well worth reading.
As to cat's claw, there is a difference of opinion over whether cat's claw or a derivative of it called Samento is a better treatment. I have not formed an opinion on that point.
If you can find an herbalist/naturopath/whatever to work with, I would suggest you consider it, because the synergies among the selection of herbs you pick may not be as beneficial as a different combo. As in: I like chocolate, cinnamon and mint; all three of them in the same dish might be good, and chocolate with either of them might be good, but cinnamon and mint together might be bit jarring. Not everything works together.
No on ehere is medicallly trained that I know of, but we're happy to share our experiences and thoughts.
Best wishes --
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