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Day 2 Subutex Reduction
Hi friends
I am here in the UK and on a subutex script.
For 8 yrs. I was on massive amounts of dihyrocodeine - I guess a mixture of hydro and vicodin - powerful stuff. I had built up to about 40 x 30mg a day and it was killing me. Originally started taking it for pain for an old spinal injury and stuck to the 8 per day. But with all addicts we tend to have heavy baggage and kid ourselves we are taking it for pain but really we are taking it to block of all the bad stuff that has happened to us in our lives that we cannot deal with, or can no longer cope with. We like the euphoria, the energy and being able to block things off. So we end up addicts.
Beg. of Nov. started on 6mg of subutex. First 6 weeks no withdrawals and just felt normal but emotionally nothing.
Started taking vitamins and minerals, good diet and building up a good exercise regime which for me was walking - now 40-50mins. per day. Stopped taking valium at night. Then first 6 weeks of year felt fantastic! Was reducing at 0.4mg per week. 'Natural energy', or so I thought, tremendous peace of mind and a zest for life I had not felt in years. I thought I was winning all round - the addiction and all my demons. Night meant pain at night and sleeping on and off all through the night and temp. swinging up and down. But okay. Head was clear and I looked a million times better. Sussed!
Down to 3.6mg and breakthrough pain started so I was told to stay on the 3.6mg and that was 9 weeks ago then the depression started. And boy oh boy it has been a roller coaster of horrors. With subutex, people talk of the 'honeymoon period' of feeling great, and then falling down. Fall I did. Anxiety attacks, pessimism about the future, no hope, severe anger about the whole of my life, bitterness, hatred, real extremes - the demons truly came to visit, and real, deep, profound unhappiness. Depression personified. The odd days bearable inbetween. Started researching subutex and found this could happen to people who had mental health problems, had not had such a great deal in life through things happening to them such as traumatic car crashes changing their lives and **** childhoods(!), and history of depression. Had not chosen methadone to get of the pills as knew I did not have the discipline not to abuse it. So ... what to do?
The shorter time you are on subutex apparently, the easier the withdrawal at the end, and the less likelihood of PAWS from what I can gather. I just want off it. Have had 3 days of feeling okay mentally and want to be rid of it. The dihydro should be gone and now this stuff, yet another addictive chemical needs to **** off too!
Docs need to tell you about the negative sides of the drugs that help you come off your DOC when they prescribe them. Had I known what was in store ..... I would never have stopped reducing back in Feb. Have wasted 2 months letting the subutex get more of a hold.
Day 2 - am down to 3.2mg. Need to take into account the half life, storage of subutex in body fat people talk about. If I feel stable after 5 days I will drop another 0.4 mg. Get the tablets in 2mg and 0.4mg.
Prior to starting, I began taking vitamins and minerals and making sure I was on a good diet, which I had let slip during the bad depression, which is when you just don't care. Had kept up the exercise because my dog needed to still get out and she has helped me a lot. Taking her to the fields and woods has helped me think a lot of stuff out. When I don't want to go, I force myself to. Seeing her enjoyment as she hunts and plays brings me pleasure when nothing else does.
Would be happy to hear from others - good stories and bad, and those that want to take the same journey. I will always reply.
Take care all
- F
I am here in the UK and on a subutex script.
For 8 yrs. I was on massive amounts of dihyrocodeine - I guess a mixture of hydro and vicodin - powerful stuff. I had built up to about 40 x 30mg a day and it was killing me. Originally started taking it for pain for an old spinal injury and stuck to the 8 per day. But with all addicts we tend to have heavy baggage and kid ourselves we are taking it for pain but really we are taking it to block of all the bad stuff that has happened to us in our lives that we cannot deal with, or can no longer cope with. We like the euphoria, the energy and being able to block things off. So we end up addicts.
Beg. of Nov. started on 6mg of subutex. First 6 weeks no withdrawals and just felt normal but emotionally nothing.
Started taking vitamins and minerals, good diet and building up a good exercise regime which for me was walking - now 40-50mins. per day. Stopped taking valium at night. Then first 6 weeks of year felt fantastic! Was reducing at 0.4mg per week. 'Natural energy', or so I thought, tremendous peace of mind and a zest for life I had not felt in years. I thought I was winning all round - the addiction and all my demons. Night meant pain at night and sleeping on and off all through the night and temp. swinging up and down. But okay. Head was clear and I looked a million times better. Sussed!
Down to 3.6mg and breakthrough pain started so I was told to stay on the 3.6mg and that was 9 weeks ago then the depression started. And boy oh boy it has been a roller coaster of horrors. With subutex, people talk of the 'honeymoon period' of feeling great, and then falling down. Fall I did. Anxiety attacks, pessimism about the future, no hope, severe anger about the whole of my life, bitterness, hatred, real extremes - the demons truly came to visit, and real, deep, profound unhappiness. Depression personified. The odd days bearable inbetween. Started researching subutex and found this could happen to people who had mental health problems, had not had such a great deal in life through things happening to them such as traumatic car crashes changing their lives and **** childhoods(!), and history of depression. Had not chosen methadone to get of the pills as knew I did not have the discipline not to abuse it. So ... what to do?
The shorter time you are on subutex apparently, the easier the withdrawal at the end, and the less likelihood of PAWS from what I can gather. I just want off it. Have had 3 days of feeling okay mentally and want to be rid of it. The dihydro should be gone and now this stuff, yet another addictive chemical needs to **** off too!
Docs need to tell you about the negative sides of the drugs that help you come off your DOC when they prescribe them. Had I known what was in store ..... I would never have stopped reducing back in Feb. Have wasted 2 months letting the subutex get more of a hold.
Day 2 - am down to 3.2mg. Need to take into account the half life, storage of subutex in body fat people talk about. If I feel stable after 5 days I will drop another 0.4 mg. Get the tablets in 2mg and 0.4mg.
Prior to starting, I began taking vitamins and minerals and making sure I was on a good diet, which I had let slip during the bad depression, which is when you just don't care. Had kept up the exercise because my dog needed to still get out and she has helped me a lot. Taking her to the fields and woods has helped me think a lot of stuff out. When I don't want to go, I force myself to. Seeing her enjoyment as she hunts and plays brings me pleasure when nothing else does.
Would be happy to hear from others - good stories and bad, and those that want to take the same journey. I will always reply.
Take care all
- F
Best Answer
Try to give yourself a break. I have found that most addicts are really great people, so awesome in fact, they beat themselves up for not being perfect. The problems in the world and life seem to touch the addict in a personal way. You will have the rest of your life to make up lost time, you will have time to be the person you intend to be. I found that I am becoming a better person and living a better life than I thought I was capable of. Stay focused on recovery, all the rest will fall into place. Great work so far. Time heals all things.
Hey Fee.....have been following you here......you are doing GREAT on your taper. I have enjoyed reading all you have shared!
I was one of those that went ON subs knowing "nothing" and jumped off at a ridiculously HIGH dose in ignorance, as well. So.....it is a delight to read this thread and see that you are doing SO GOOD! Of course, I have learned A LOT about subs since then and am always glad to read about others who equip themselves before, during and after. So good on ya!
Also, wanted to ask you what a bu trans patch is? I am always interested in learning about ways to deal with chronic pain. So, if and when you get time....can you share what that is w/me please?
Blessings to you~
I was one of those that went ON subs knowing "nothing" and jumped off at a ridiculously HIGH dose in ignorance, as well. So.....it is a delight to read this thread and see that you are doing SO GOOD! Of course, I have learned A LOT about subs since then and am always glad to read about others who equip themselves before, during and after. So good on ya!
Also, wanted to ask you what a bu trans patch is? I am always interested in learning about ways to deal with chronic pain. So, if and when you get time....can you share what that is w/me please?
Blessings to you~
You may have to drop every two to three weeks if the symptoms get bad. People on subs for years seem to do best with 21 days between drops, that's how long the last dose stays in your system. I used subs for a short taper, but. I started to feel it at about 1mg and was dropping every 3 days. At.5, the symptoms where getting bad and I jumped. I wasn't as educated on subs then. Going too fast has many draw backs. Once the WD gets bad, it's hard to get stable again. It takes some time. There's no disadvantage for going too slow. I know that when you are ready, you are ready, but remember that you get the rest of your life back and all the time you need to heal yourself and anything that was effected by opiate use. I'm not saying that you need to be on subs for years, but give yourself a break if you need it. Slow and steady wins the race. Can't tell you how many times I was told that. I'm pretty hard headed, so I had to screw up a lot. That's what I love about this forum. Nobody seemed to give up on me and kept reminding me that I'm worth it. So if any of my mistakes and hard-headed personality can help, let me know, because you are worth it. You have a good outlook and obvious determination, congrats on your progress so far.
Thank you - that's very useful to know! Been on subs for 6 months now. Been tapering down from Started at 6mg 6 months ago. Been tapering down from 3.6mg now for 3.5 weeks at 0.4mg every 3 days, with only very mild WDs - feeling cold basically but feeling fine mentally.
Will try a 0.4mg drop tomorrow and if I DO feel bad, depending on how bad, I will try and stick it out. My key worker wanted me to be down to 2mg by the 13th anyway.
I just wanted to beat that amount as I need to be getting on the bu trans patches for pain and the amount of subs I am is way less analgesia wise than the 10mc I will be put on.
Will post on progress as it useful for other people if I am successful.
Thank you again.
- F
Will try a 0.4mg drop tomorrow and if I DO feel bad, depending on how bad, I will try and stick it out. My key worker wanted me to be down to 2mg by the 13th anyway.
I just wanted to beat that amount as I need to be getting on the bu trans patches for pain and the amount of subs I am is way less analgesia wise than the 10mc I will be put on.
Will post on progress as it useful for other people if I am successful.
Thank you again.
- F
The half life is so long, when you take 2mg a day for an extended period eventually for anybody it will have all their receptors filled. Everyone I know can stay outta physical WDs using that 2mg doseage..... Thats if they didn't start initially at higher doses though.
But anyone tapering once you hit 2mg definitely slow it down. Like .2mg every 10-12 days.
But anyone tapering once you hit 2mg definitely slow it down. Like .2mg every 10-12 days.
Hi Weaver71
Down to 2mg from tomorrow. Been doing 0.2mg every 3 days for the past 22 days now. You suggested slowing down at 2mg. Please may I ask your advice, if possible, how much I should slow down. Been feeling okay - just a bit cold and a bit sniffly etc. so very mild WD symptoms indeed. Maybe go 4 days at a time and see how it goes.
Any advice/suggestions would be very much appreciated.
Thank you.
All the best
- Fee
Down to 2mg from tomorrow. Been doing 0.2mg every 3 days for the past 22 days now. You suggested slowing down at 2mg. Please may I ask your advice, if possible, how much I should slow down. Been feeling okay - just a bit cold and a bit sniffly etc. so very mild WD symptoms indeed. Maybe go 4 days at a time and see how it goes.
Any advice/suggestions would be very much appreciated.
Thank you.
All the best
- Fee
Oh no I'm not getting pain from WDs - an old spinal cord injury and have overdone it recently so no sleep and some screamin'! Too stubborn and don't like limiting my life then end up paying for it hard so in bed for 2 days.
Only WDs on 2.2mg are mild - coldness, sniffles and problems with bladder and started getting rumble tum, the latter of the two gets more of a prob in situations like this for people who start WDs. Dropping 0.2 mg every 3 days and know it will get tough under 2mg as paying for 8 yrs of addiction. You may not get WDs on 2mg cos you were hardcore but other mates. equally hardcore, did. Every individual reacts differently to drugs as I am sure you must be aware of which is why some people make it or die from very little.
Hope you are doing good.
Only WDs on 2.2mg are mild - coldness, sniffles and problems with bladder and started getting rumble tum, the latter of the two gets more of a prob in situations like this for people who start WDs. Dropping 0.2 mg every 3 days and know it will get tough under 2mg as paying for 8 yrs of addiction. You may not get WDs on 2mg cos you were hardcore but other mates. equally hardcore, did. Every individual reacts differently to drugs as I am sure you must be aware of which is why some people make it or die from very little.
Hope you are doing good.
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