question about sub

[mdan9mm]

Hey everyone, hope all is well. This is day 16 for me on the sub and i saw my dr today. among other things we talked about was this website as i tell him i've learned alot of important things about the use of sub on this site and that everyone here truely seems down to earth and really cares about each other, as were all in the same boat, sort of. Among what we talked about was my concern about the  " severe wd's " from the sub when it is finally time to stop. Again, this is only my 16th day on it and im doing 6 mg per day, down from 16mg a day. I'm doing fine, no wd's, no cravings for the hydro's, go to work, play with the kids, pretty much just back to being " normal ' , whatever that is...lol..!!.  I also have been on seraquel and trazadone to sleep since getting out of detox, and since i started the sub, I have NOT taken ONE of those to sleep as im getting about 6-8 hrs a sleep a night just from being on the sub. I'm still taking the 20 mg lexapro for the depression though, but thats it. My dr said im getting too worried about the wd's when i stop (from what i've learned from you guys). He asked me then to post a question on how did those of you on the sub, finally stop (taper off) as im sure it worked wonders for most of you, AND that most of you did not experience severe wd's ( at least i hope not !! ). Like i said its only my 16th day and i know ill be probably be on it for a while longer, and i dont have a problem with it as long as I feel good, and i dont have any craving to use again. I go to a one on one with my dr once a week, and am going to start those group meetings hopefully in a few days. Thanks, Mark...

[wannabefree330]

for those of you who have had the he!! from w/d off sub.....would you choose to continue your opiate addiction, or get on the sub?  Saying you would "try something different" doesn't count.  IF you could go back to the day you switched to sub......would you?  Given what you know now?  Or would you have stayed on your DOC?  

Is it safe to say that 100% of those prescribed sub, who use as prescribed and taper as directed, have these awful experiences?  

[ochooked]

This is a very good thread and I hope it gets bumped back to the top.  Almost all of us felt really good about using it after reading all of the positive stuff on the web sites that promote it.  It is only on sites like this one when real people who use it come and testify what it did to them, that the true nature of Sub comes out.  I have had a lot of PM's from those who told me that "the doctor can't be wrong, must be something wrong with you".  Most of the positive things people have to say about Sub are those who are still on it  ----- it is not until you try to get off it that Sub shows its true and wicked nature.   I cringe every time I read a post that says someone is going from Hydrocodone to Sub.  It is really jumping out of the frying pan and into the fire.  Well, all we can do is keep sharing our own stories and perhaps save some the agony we went through.  All the best.

[laurel453]

and thanks for your opinion : )  .

i can agree too  with you that as you say the sub can be a really good tool for  lessening or avoiding the physical wds of the strongest drugs. And also i think that every experience about whatever need some time  after its use for understanding better the results and consequences and  the real success of it....and that  can be  infered  from your experience and what's your opinion now of it.

at the end ( that's my opinion too here :) ) and  speaking about  other pain killers addictions, it seems to me that   being on sub has been  a  too tortuous path for some people and even meant a worse and longer detox in the long term  and one can not only explained it  by the  little knowledge of sub that the doctors have. It's a too easy way out for the sub stuff and its implications. i think so.

[refusingbondage]

I was a walking advertisement for suboxone while I was on it for 2 years.  I thought it was a miracle.  I found my sub doctor through the www.naabt.org site when searching for detox centers, I found that site and thought - wow.. in office.. I dont have to check in to detox .. and no withdrawal.. im in.  I was very close to the sub doc as I saw him once or twice a month for two years.. I am not saying sub doesnt have its place there are still heroine addicts I know who I recommend sub to all the time -- because it does help you learn to live without your drugs (except for the suboxone) -- but without expecting it or even knowing its happening to you,you become very addicted to sub and it has a much stronger hold on you than most other painkillers and this seems to be something the naabt.org or suboxone.com or the sub doctors do not fully explain to their patients.  Just my opinion though.    

[laurel453]

i  can see the point that refusingbondage is making..in fact, i was wondering just about the same.

i've just been in that page and ok, it's similar to any advertising page for  whatever  the stuff and full of successful stories like if it were some magic discovery of the century  ( i gonna believe they are as true as the ones from people rejecting it after taking it ... ) .

and yours, shelwoy is one of the succesful ones, but you're still on it after a year , are you ? may i ask you why ?  or it's just that one has to be depending  on sub for a long, long time to recover from opiates while on  sub ... i don't understand it since you are still needing an opiate replacement...how can we talk of something succesful until you'll live without it ? if i can ask it...

[liscamdave]

Well, you may not get too many responses that will make you feel better about the sub. To be honest, I would say that more on here don't praise it as much. The w.d from sub can be 10x's worst then that of your original DOC. But it all depends on how long you stay on it. And how much you are taking. I did a 21 day treatment with sub but was on it for about 27 days total. I started out with 16mgs a day and by day 3, I was down to half that, and so on and so forth. By the 27th day, I was taking less then 1mg, every other day until I could sleep for about 4 days without the sub. Sub has a 25-36hr half life. So when you stop it, its still in your system for another 36 hrs. And you will still feel its effects for about that long, then any left over w.d will kick in. So when you stop, make sure you wait a good 3 days, before you start jumpin for joy that you by-passed the w.d. I had w.d, not as bad as before, but I had it and it wasn't all that great. But It was way more managable then anything else.

In my own opinion, no one can eliminate w.d altogether. No one.  But you can reduce its wrath. Just taper to as lil as you can, and do NOT stay on it long term. The people who have had the best expereince with the sub, are those who only took it for less then a month. Good luck;....